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What's wrong with preventing reaching humans?

(11 posts)
  1. allcreatures

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 22 2014 2:42:25
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    I've heard skepticism from people (I think in particular David Cain) about measures to prevent bed bugs reaching people to feed on. For example, water traps around bed legs.

    If all BBs in a home can be prevented from reaching humans to feed, then reinfestation and detection are no longer relevant in that home - right?

    Thanks

  2. ITortureBugs4Revenge

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 22 2014 4:20:24
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    The only potential problems i can see happening with that methodology is that the now starved bugs will either start feeding on pets and/or migrate into neighboring apartments out of desperation for a meal. Other than that i see nothing else wrong with doing it.

    .....I am NOT an expert.....

    Any advice i give here is based solely on my own personal experiences in dealing with bedbugs & other household vermin.
  3. BigDummy

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 22 2014 7:07:06
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    If it isn't 100% then it isn't a solution, you'll just displace them and make them harder to find.

  4. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 22 2014 8:43:27
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    Yikes !

    This is one of the volatile subjects discussed on this Forum which initiates much controversy largely due to the dichotomy of fundamental divergence in remediation strategies championed by certain folks who participate on this Forum.

    Below are my comments for your review and observation:

    > In my view we need to set targets and goals for the results of our work to attain. Such basic goals include: a) To prevent the customer/bed bug victim from being bitten, b) To preserve the customer's assets, and, c) To render the infested location bed bug free. "Lofty" goals ? Perhaps but we are being successful in attaining them via suitable efforts and methodologies.

    > Using bed bug "blockers" is nothing new. In fact, man has been doing this for hundreds if not thousands of years. Depending upon your age, grand or great parents can relate stories about placing tin cans or bowls containing various liquids to prevent bed bugs from climbing up bed legs at night to bite the sleeping host.

    > Are blockers alone going to help eliminate a bed bug infestation? No. C'mon, that's just crazy talk.

    > Can such bug blocker techniques help to prevent your sleeping child from being bitten? Yes and this is one good reason to use this methodology.

    > However, this methodology is best used in combination with others which will result in the overall elimination of bed bugs in YOUR home.

    > Will "questing" bed bugs find a way around or defeat your blockers? Not so much. They're bugs. They have rather simple "brains" and cannot problem solve as say a rodent can solve a maze.

    > Will "some" individual bed bugs find a way to defeat or get around the blockers? Hmmm . . . This is an interesting concept and discussion and has been posted and argued about on this Forum previously "ad nausium". Individual behavior cannot be equivocated with the behavior of the "entire population" of bed bugs which may be present at an infested location. It's simply not so.

    Sure, we may see one or a few individual bed bugs display a certain unique behavior but to extrapolate this behavior across the entire population is incorrect.

    > Above I mentioned ". . . in combination with . . ." and this is a VERY IMPORTANT part of my view on this subject. Here's why:

    * "In combination" means that we should be using blockers as part of our overall comprehensive bed bug remediation program and NOT as "the only" thing we do and NOT as one of "just a few" things that we do to eliminate the bed bugs from our home.

    * We need to implement a comprehensive effort that eliminates bed bugs on day one. Yes, this is setting the bar high however, it is much better to set our aim high and perhaps narrowly miss then to set our aim low and score a hit. Donchathink?

    * And, if we do a darn good job at eliminating bed bugs on day one, do we really need to be concerned about the "phantom bed bug" that's going to circumvent our blocker devices ? No, not really.

    > RESOURCES: What's often overlooked in these discussions is the limited financial and other resources available to the bed bug victim seeking help and viable guidance. Sure, if someone can afford professional bed bug work that's great. In my experience the great majority of the folks who seek assistance cannot afford professional services. As such, these folks are often left to their own ingenuity and efforts in seeking relief from bed bugs.

    We've seen such people go to great lengths with the materials and resources available to them in order to attain some level of relief from the bed bugs biting themselves, their families and children each night. And desperate times are met with desperate measures. They use tape, plastic wrap, self applied sprays, etc. but what they most need is suitable guidance.

    Let me know if any other questions.

    I gotta go, have a great day ! pjb

  5. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 22 2014 9:01:02
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    Hi Allcreatures,

    I can only confirm what we found when we initially tested the approach in 2007 and that is:

    The treatment of cases where isolation was used in conjunction with treatment required more treatments than those that did not.

    This was both in terms of the extent of the area that needed to be used as well as the number of treatments that were required to achieve 100% eradication.

    In extreme cases where people have undertaken long term isolation we have observed that bedbugs become more dispersed and seek secondary feeding opportunities in sofas, chairs and in some cases with secondary hosts such as rodents.

    This combined with the fact that achieving 100% isolation via this approach is difficult if not impossible you would be better off putting time into finding and physically removing bedbugs by sticking them to tape.

    Someone commented the other day that they were facing a big treatment expense and then still needed to buy isolation devices because their PCO said so. They questioned the validity of this given that they were paying to get the place treated and had an expectation that the treatment would eradicate the issue. To that end I would rather do the job correctly the first time, to keep the issue focused and unlikely to disperse and as such resolve my cases faster and more efficiently.

    Yes I am the most out spoken advocate in this camp / school of thought but I am far from alone. I am sure others will speak out when they are less likley to be bullied and berated for doing so.

    I can also note that although the concept was started in 1865 by E B Lake there is a distinct lack of mentioned of these products and approach by the peak of the problem in the 1930's. I would have thought had it been successful back then that we would have found more references to them. Most modern references track back to an author who is also on the patent or to those with a vested interest in the success of the product.

    I also believe that psychologically this approach does a lot of damage because people may still get bitten despite isolation and as such they automatically feel that there is something failing. It also can be a compounding factor in cases where bedbugs are not the actual cause. Yes it may seem odd that I have concerns in those areas but I take a great pride in being the first in the same way that you would have with the first to the North Pole or the first to summit Everest.

    Finally the approach does nothing to help people understand the simple reality that "they have acquired bedbugs somehow" and that while they may feel safe at night with the drawbridge pulled up winning against bedbugs is as much about not bringing more in as it is dealing with the ones you already have.

    I hope that make sense.

    David Cain
    Bed Bugs Limited

    If you have found this information helpful please consider leaving feedback on social media via google+ or FaceBook or by like/loving the images.

    In accordance with the AUP and FTC (legal requirements) I openly disclose my vested interest in Passive Monitors as the inventor and patent holder. Since 2009 they have become an integral part in how we resolve bed bug infestations. I also have a professional relationship with PackTite in that they distribute my product under their own branding. I do not however receive any financial remuneration for any comments I make about products.
  6. Daylight

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 22 2014 9:37:27
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    BigDummy wrote,

    If it isn't 100% then it isn't a solution, you'll just displace them and make them harder to find.

    I also believe this to be true. If you get them and keep them in your bed, at least you can find them and eradicate them sooo much easier than if you don't know where they are (under a baseboard or cabinet or in the wall or ceiling molding or ?).

    This is even more important than ever due to the weak nature of the chemicals we are currently allowed to use or be used on the vermin. Most of the agents we can use to kill them only work with direct contact, so we really do need to have them where we can find them and make the kill.

    I understand trying to protect the children--that is necessary. But isolating all the beds will only prolong and complicate the agony of bed bugs, IMHO.

  7. ITortureBugs4Revenge

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 23 2014 2:29:09
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    I kind of agree with Daylight. It would be better to allow the bugs access to the bed for the simple reason they will be concentrated in that area and thus easier to find and kill as opposed to having desperate and starving bugs wandering all over the place.

  8. bugAnxiety

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 23 2014 11:12:08
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    What about preventing them from feeding using traps like climb-ups? Also, what about for preventing an infestation? It seems like if you catch the first few immigrant bugs to wander in that you would prevent a bug metropolis from forming.

  9. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 23 2014 12:21:41
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    Hi bugAnxiety,

    It was the ClimbUps I tested in 2007.

    The only thing you can do to prevent an infestation is to avoid contact with bedbugs where possible. This can only really be done through steps like this:

    • Checking hotel rooms
    • Checking items brought into the home
    • Checking locations before sitting
    • Communicating with others about bedbugs to reduce the risk of them having a problem
    • Decontaminating your luggage following trips
    • Speaking to overnight guests about bedbugs before they stay so they don't leave anything behind

    The next line of defense is to identify the issue quickly where it is easier to resolve and less likley to have such a huge impact. While there are options out there for doing this the easiest, most intuitive and most cost/labor effective is through Passive Monitoring.

    This uses my Passive Monitoring technology to induce faecal traces and cast skins on an optimal harbourage which bedbugs tend to use and choose over other potential refugia. The induction of the faecal traces gives you a clear indication of an issue and the extent of the faecal traces will also tell you how many and how long the problem has been present.

    In cases where the infestation is caught quickly and we have independent data to confirm confirmation with 12 - 72 hours from introduction. At this stage as our commercial clients have found dealing with an infestation can be as simple as replacing the monitor and deep cleaning the room. I have made a version of this available online as a workbook called "treatment by Passive Monitor replacement".

    This switch from a reactive to a ProActive approach has been the focus of my work since 2009 and we have now developed the processes, procedures and training to an extent that we do train people all over the world using a 100% green and sustainable approach to dealing with infestations. I have shared the letters of testimonial and proof with those who could verify all these claims as well.

    The major issue I rare talk about is the huge impact it has on staff morale. So often they have been fighting an issue for multiple years and the costs are spiraling out of control year on year. This is not only in terms of treatments but the staff replacements and incidental costs. One of the worst we were called into was in excess of $75,000 pa and only going up. Within a week it was under control and since the hand over they have never had an infestation that was not detected and resolved within 24 hours because we put the disciplines in place from the start. They still get the same number of introduced cases but the impact is so greatly reduced that they are dealt with in the same way that leaking tap would be.

    I am sorry that I cant be more open and free with all these resources but what has taken us 5 years to build is the product of a continual feedback and evolution process that has with time moved me from the 100% field based role to trouble shooter and developer in my own company with teams of technicians undertaking the routine treatments. A far cry from what I originally envisaged as a highly specialist one man band but we evolve into roles, even when they include long hours sitting a PC writing webpages and editing training videos (the forum can at times be a pleasant distraction).

    Hope that helps,

    David

  10. ITortureBugs4Revenge

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 24 2014 2:10:34
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    When i had an infestation, before the apartment building was professionally treated, i used a strategy of once per day inspection of the bed and killing on sight any bugs or eggs i found, and doing that really made a noticeable dent in the amount of bugs i was dealing with in short order and it may have eventually eliminated them from my apartment completely if i was allowed to continue down that road. Remember that bedbugs like to harbor close to their food source, and under normal circumstances the only time they spread out away from the bed or sofa is either because the infestation has been neglected to the point of being massive or because the bugs were purposely provoked into behaving abnormally, which is usually due to excluding them from their source of food (Which is you) or because of the use of inappropriate chemicals or foggers.

  11. Disgusted2

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 29 2014 15:35:23
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    I am speaking from the experience of having had a huge infestation in my brother's bedroom. He is disabled due to multiple sclerosis, and he spends a huge amount of time sleeping in his bed in a dark bedroom, and he has vision problems due to the m.s. We think he got the bed bugs from attending church services.

    The bed bugs had an almost constant source of food, and he thought the bites were being caused by mosquitoes, so they went undetected for a very long time.

    The infestation grew out of control to the point where he saw adults and nymphs running all over the top of his bed. I was seeing them in other rooms, and had no idea what they were at the time. By the time we figured out these were bed bugs, his box springs mattress was heavily infested with bed bugs, his bedroom was infested, and we made the mistake of using bed bug spray from the grocery store to go after them with. They spread all over the house after that.

    We are living off of his social security disability money and the rather low wages I get from working at a grocery store. Simply not enough to afford to pay a professional thousands of dollars to treat for bugs that may just come back again at some point in the future.

    So, we went the isolation route with mattress encasements, pillow encasements, climb up bed frame leg protectors, moving the beds away from the walls, and washing all clothing and bed sheets, etc., in hot water and drying them on high and then storing everything in zip lock bags to keep them bed bug free until we need them. We also put a thin layer of D.E. down in various places to kill bed bugs walking around at night.

    It took months, but I haven't seen a bed bug since December 2013. And it is now hot in Phoenix, Arizona, so, they should not still be in hibernation mode.

    Are they all 100% gone? Who knows, and frankly, who cares? There are now so few of them, we don't see them anymore. They don't bite us anymore. We will never let them get out of control to the point where we have an infestation again, so it really does not matter. People literally freak out about these bugs, but hey, they are not going to kill you, and you can fight them and beat them back to almost oblivion.

    I think other than the encasement of mattresses, etc., the main thing to do is to wash your bed sheets, pillows, pajamas, etc., weekly, and when doing so, pick up your mattresses and inspect for any bed bugs. If you find any, kill them. Just doing this would prevent from getting out of control. They want to live with you in your bed. If they can't do this, they will never grow into a huge colony.

    I should mention that we live in a detached house, so we do not share any walls with any neighbors, and that makes a huge difference. If you live in an apartment, it may be very difficult to fight bed bugs on your own, and win against them.

    But it is still worth a try.

    Oh, I forgot to mention pets. We have a black lab dog. We isolated her bed using a raised dog bed with short legs. The legs were put down into little cups which we filled up part way with vegetable oil, so the bed bugs can't get to her. For her crate, we put down a thick piece of plastic on the floor, then put her crate on it and lightly dusted the plastic around her crate with D.E. I also brush her hair every day or every other day, and try to look for bed bugs in her hair. So far, I haven't found anything in her hair in the recent past. We also use the generic version of a flea and tick killer that comes in a little tube of liquid that you squirt on her shoulders once a month. It supposedly kills and repels fleas, ticks, and mosquitoes. It may not kill bed bugs, but you don't want fleas or ticks in your apartment, either.

    Gosh, I took all this time to say that yes, isolation does work for some people like me. But you must be patient, vigilant, and you must not freak out about these bugs. They are not going to kill you. There are so many other things in the world to worry about. These are a minor pest that humans have lived with for centuries. If you want to fear something, fear rats. They're much worse to deal with. We had roof rats for awhile, and one of them got into the house and we only figured it out when we saw something had eaten our raw potatoes and raw bananas on the kitchen counter. I got a rat trap, put peanut butter and cheese in it. The rat ignored it. I put raw banana in it, and BAM! It killed the rat the very next evening. Rats love bananas. I had no idea.


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