They will never be gone...never, never, never(35 posts)
Just found out that my parents have them too. Spoke with an exterminator who said the truth is that they never do go away, in an apartment you are simply holding them at bay. Can we live a normal life again? We own our apartment we can't just move....so sad! Any words of encouragement?
Keep the faith and battle on! You have no other option.
Thanks Lieut, I know we have to keep up the fight:) I just want them to not be such an issue anymore.
For now, keep fighting...and keep reading here, for the latest info and moral support. Long term, I'd make plans to sell. I am so sorry.
Lies. They can be destroyed, it just takes three things. Fear, surprise, ruthless efficiency and an almost fanatical devotion to the pope. Oooh.
Seriously though what he said is plain incorrect. They're "just" a stupid bug. If you start living the plastic lifestyle, do all the prep work, have him spray, seal up all the cracks they can enter/exit through, then 21 days later max the eggs will hatch and you spray again, and they're likely gone for good.
Depending on what furniture you have, that is, and assuming you're going to be using yourself as blood bait during that time. There's about a month of feeding I think between the eggs hatching and them being able to lay new eggs. So you get that second baby batch in that time and you win.
Most of the failures on here I think have been due to people being unable to seal up the entry/exit points, or trying to do things themselves without a PCO, or using a crap PCO, or they "miss" something like an electrical outlet - no offense intended.
I think the PCO is right IF the neighbors have them and are not getting treatment. If all adjacent units are not also inspected and treated if necessary, then yes, you will not be able to get rid of them.
But that scenario is not a good one for anyone (you, neighbors, landlord if any) and in the long run will be disastrous. Eventually, if untreated in other units, they will overrun the building and someone will have to pay a lot of money to solve the problem. Better to deal with it now, and both treatment AND the education of residents and building staff are needed.
Long term example. I treated 19 rooms on 3 different floors for Bed bugs in a motel. THEY DON'T HAVE BED BUGS ANYMORE! I treated 16 apts. on 4 floors 2 & 1/2 years ago. THEY DON'T HAVE BEDBUGS ANYMORE! Just make sure each apt. is getting treated and checked. Sounds like you need a better PMP with some confidence or a talk with the landlord
What tactics and chemicals did you use?
I'm in each room for a very long time. I don't leave untill I look and touch everything. My treatment methods are a long story, im on a laptop now laying in bed. I'll type this over tomorrow on my desk top if i can with some more info. But the products I use you may not be able to use.
If you have secrets or you up you dosage than I will not expect an answer but there is enough work to go around so you should not be worried about that. Any information shared is always appreciated.
ugh, don't tell me they never die...ugh, i hope this vinyl sheet works, at least for the ones in my bed...i can't afford a new mattress and you know what sucks, they are doing construction all over the complex, and in my apartment too...there are huge holes in my walls from the construction and they haven't been plastered yet...we saw the plaster guy today, but he's only on the 9th floor, we're the first...that's going to take a few days...what should I do until then to try to avoid any getting in????
What do you do about inside walls and floor boards?
de inside walls through light sockets and caulk floor boards
"If you have secrets or you up you dosage than I will not expect an answer but there is enough work to go around so you should not be worried about that. Any information shared is always appreciated."
I never up my dosage as you say or asked. If you apply products the right way by label directions, they work. I have a long list of things I do to each room. Every treatment is different so after my first inspection (40 minutes minimum BTW) I come up with a game plan for each room I'm going to treat. While I'm treating I'm inspecting as well. I don't have people remove anything from a room. This is how the problem gets worse. I look over the clothes, shoes, books, cluttered items etc... This is where I get my kills. If something needs laundering its bagged and sealed for the client to wash when they get home by me. The note on the bag will let you know what needs to hit the laundry or dry cleaner. The problem with this industry is someone came up with the laundry lists of things you should do before treatment. Bag this, remove that, toss that in the trash, remove the sheets for inspection blah blah blah. This is how you disturb the bugs that were perfectly comfortable where they were. Why would you want to disturb these locations is beyond me. But every Company follows these steps. Example: I was walking into a location on Saturday a woman is yelling for me outside because we are at this location every month for roach and rodent management. I told her I will see her upstairs at her apartment. She had just picked up a new dog she was asking me about a flee bath for the dog because she thought the dog had flees. She told me she was getting bit around the ankles. I said can I look at your bed please, she said for flees, I said no, I walked to the bed lifted the calendar off the wall to expose about 6 right there. First thing out of here mouth, I have to through everything away right? Many places on the net, PMP’s etc. are giving out the wrong info. Not to mention, armatures doing self treatments, PMP’s not into solving problems, just grinding it out for a paycheck and can care less once the day is done. That will only make the problem with bed bugs worse in years to come. Espouser to chemicals without kills is only going to make this bug better at what it does. The problem is the BOSS wants it done ASAP... do a good job but get to the next stop ASAP. This does not fly with me and my boss knows it. We aint cheap! It will cost you a nice buck, but I knock out I would say close to 97% of my clients problems on the first visit. They never call back to complain, only to ask what to expect till we return. For a long time we didn't go back till 30 days after the first visit. And still no complaints. I don't want people here to get the wrong idea of me, I'm not full of myself, I just will not do the job without the proper amount of time, the wrong products, or the knowledge I have taught myself over the years. Yes the boss cuts the checks, but it is me who needs to solve the problem the people are facing. I know I can do it ... just let me. Techniques? Yeah I have them, but that’s like giving up the secret sauce. I will help those how I can but I can’t give away what I do to PCO’s on here. I’m about to open my own Business is a few weeks. I’ll help those who IM me. There is already enough competition in this industry. I’m a guy starting from scratch. But I am going to give my services away for free to 1 person on this forum who has a bed bug problem. This person will have children, short on cash to pay for treatment, or has been let down by past companies. I will show how inspecting while treating takes time, results that most want can be achieved if the people who walk in your door know what they are doing. OK long enough =) I’m sure I’ll get bashed for my mouth
If you're getting 97% success in your accounts in one treatment then you know something every expert in the country doesn't know. I've completed 100's of jobs and that's an impossible number to achieve, unless you're spending an entire day at each account regardless of infestation size. Even still, that number isn't happening.
Full of yourself would be an understatement.
KillerQueen, Thanks for taking the time.
I do find it hard to digest that you solve 97% of your cases in the first treatment.
As far as upping the dose I understand many PCOs do this. We know that a great resistance against pesticides exists right now. Since these creatures are so stealth how is it possible to make sure that you have gotten every egg or bug if they may exist in a location that is hard to reach such as a crevice in the bed or a screw hole under a piece of heavy furniture. I do agree with you on not moving things around until a PCO treats the structure and I have posted that a while ago on this site.
"If you're getting 97% success in your accounts in one treatment then you know something every expert in the country doesn't know. I've completed 100's of jobs and that's an impossible number to achieve, unless you're spending an entire day at each account regardless of infestation size. Even still, that number isn't happening.
Full of yourself would be an understatement. "
Like I said, I know I'll here smack from the statement. I don't find many experts in this field, do you? Average results that are talked about in the country by the "experts" (and I assume when you say experts you mean the techs doing the work) Or the experts reporting on the techs in the field doing the work. Well, you don't know me, you don't know the type of person I am. I'm not the average guy walking thro the door. I never settled on anything in life as average. Average is for people who have no desire or drive to perfect their trade or craft. I do what I do, and claim what I claim because myself and my clients see the results I achieve. Nothing more! No Story. We can go back and forth, I could care less how many treatments you do. Should I get into why a boss would ask you to become his partner in a million plus business a year, in less than 6 months of working for him? Without a buy in, Just say yes. Should I ask you why a boss would tell you you’re better than anyone he has met in this industry in the past 20 years? Could I talk about taking the sales of a business from 750,000 a year to a million plus is 2 years? It’s simple, I have very very high standards of myself. I'm not one of the 100 morons you find at a pest control seminar. I'm a professional by every stretch of the word, and I give every job I do 200% of myself. I’m an anal madman. Think what you may, I know I speak the truth. I'm not impressed by your numbers or anyone in the business for that matter. I have met your kind at seminars and the like. I’m done with this thread because I will not go round and round with anyone. GOOD LUCK! Call me if you can’t solve a problem.
"I do find it hard to digest that you solve 97% of your cases in the first treatment.
As far as upping the dose I understand many PCOs do this. We know that a great resistance against pesticides exists right now. Since these creatures are so stealth how is it possible to make sure that you have gotten every egg or bug if they may exist in a location that is hard to reach such as a crevice in the bed or a screw hole under a piece of heavy furniture. I do agree with you on not moving things around until a PCO treats the structure and I have posted that a while ago on this site."
Hard to reach and impossible are 2 different things. Nothing that is hard to reach can't be treated. INSPECTION INSPECTION INSPECTION. TREAT TREAT TREAT. It all takes time, most people don't take the time that is needed to do the job right, this is why you see the results you do from PCO's. If you have to drill voids to get product in then do it, find the screw hole, bring the fight to the bug, don't leave a place so as the bug has a fighting chance. For god sakes its a bug people. Get creative, think, study, take the time ... do it right. It takes hours, and brains.
wow I hear what you are saying. I was treated three times by a company and knew that the the last two times hardly anything had been touched. For instance the remote control on my couch was in exactly the same place that I left it.
It is a desperate situation when you are the client aching to have a legal license for the chemicals to fix a situation.
Next I had a horrible situation .... with thermal..... he treated me as if I was illusion and needing therapy even before he started and then created so much damage....
Now I have another company with dogs....I hope this works. BBs are so hard to treat.
I wish you lived in my city I would contact you.
KillerQueen, you have my support. I believe there are a few real, practical BB experts out there, sounds like you are one of them.
How would you advise a landlord to treat a multi unit dwelling with a few infestations? And secondly, what would you do if they refused to follow your advice?
I have to agree with the poster that they will never be gone, never, never, never if you treat bedbugs the way a certain apartment management company I know did. 1) pretend the problem doesn't exist at all and ignore it for a long time. Even when tenants complain, tell them it's spiders or that you've "sprayed." 2) when you do finally treat, don't hire professionals. Have your own untrained hourly workers set off a few bug bombs instead. 3) when that doesn't work and the bedbugs get worse, hire the cheapest pest control firm to spray the baseboards once, and only pay them to treat the apartments where tenants complained. Don't tell anyone in the building you are treating for bedbugs. 4) When tenants with bedbugs move out and throw all their posessions in the dumpster, including new mattresses with fecal stains, don't do anything when another tenant unknowingly brings the same mattress back into the hall of the building and leaves it there for weeks. 5) Rent to new tenants through Craigslist, without mentioning that the building has an active bedbug infestation. This way you can spread bedbugs to many new tenants who move in and then immediately move out to other buildings, taking newfound bedbugs with them.
I could go on and on, but you get the picture. If the bedbug problem is not addressed thorougly and professionally, including disclosure to and education of all tenants involved, bedbugs in multi-unit buildings will never be gone, never, never, never. I have seen this happen.
I totally agree, which is the reason for my question to KillerQueen.
It’s all about education. It starts with the original tenant who makes the complaint to the super, and then the super calls the property owner. I make sure that I talk with the owner myself and everyone involved. I will refuse to do a treatment for my current company if I don’t get full cooperation from the owner. Once I explain to the owners that this problem does not go away cheap. There are no short cuts and each tenant here in NY has a legal right to the right treatment that I can provide. Once I teach the owners the biology and habits I get the open door to do all that is needed. When you explain that they can be dragged into court by tenants fed up with the problem, or end up paying more in the long run if the problem is not solved ASAP. They often listen. If they insist on telling me what and how to do it ... I walk. I have often been the 3rd or 4th guy to show up and do the work. Once you talk to people and show you know your business & they have already spent 1000.00 plus and still have a problem, it’s easy.
I was at a house 2 days ago on Long Island, talked with the home owner who rented out the house. I said to her this is the way I do my service, this is the cost, and my treatment methods are not negotiable. This is the only way you will solve the problem now. This is the only way I will provide treatment.
And don’t wait. 40 females will lay 2800 eggs in a 2 week period. Service needs to be done within 2 or 3 days … and done right the first time. This is not a problem you will win if you want to do this the cheapest way possible.
She had 2 apartments in this home. One was infested, one was not. I treat both as if they have a problem or call someone else. She was fine with everything I said. I’m treating the home tomorrow at 8AM. Another note: I make the owners buy the encasements, and I don’t leave the home until I put them on myself. I will not wait for a tenant to buy them, put them on, etc. And I don’t offer cheap 9.99 encasements.
Bottom line >> I have to make sure the property owners understand what they are up against, let them know that cheap service is just that cheap! You get what you pay for! If you want to keep collecting rents and avoiding lawsuits, listen to a professional. Leave the fix-it stuff to the super. I’ll solve the bug problem.
I agree with your stance about landlords treating adjacent units, and providing quality encasemnts for tenants. I respect PCOs who walk away from a job when the landlord will not treat all the units that need it. If everyone did this, of course, it would probably solve a lot of tenants' problems.
OTOH, we often hear from those same tenants after their landlord refused to do things properly, and hired someone with lesser standards to do the job. This seems to be a common problem.
And those folks are quite hopeless -- whether they use the landlord's PCO or hire their own PCO, the bed bugs keep coming from neighbors. Too, too many NYC landlords don't get bed bugs.
I think what some of us are concerned about in your claims, though, is that because eggs hatch in 10-14 days, and traditional treatments do not kill eggs, and even treatments that DO kill eggs are unlikely to reach all the eggs.
(I am not referring BTW to thermal treatment or vikane fumigation here, since those do not seem to be your methods.)
This is why people are finding it hard to believe you rid 97% of bed bug cases in one visit.
I don't expect you to give your trade secrets away here. However, I'd be wary of such amazing claims unless there were proven statistics. That is, someone outside of you (a trusted someone who was not connected with your business) would have to document it and vouch for it. (This is the way in which products are tested -- encasements, pesticides.)
I must admit that in the height of our infestation, if the PCO would have told me that they could get rid of them in one visit, I would have laughed in his face. No offense but that just seems very unbeliveable. I went through 9 months of hell and the only thing that I feel worked for us was ME!!! I worked my ass off and washed and dried and bagged and cleaned and did it all again the next day all while keeping the house as normal as I could with no furniture or any life. AND running a daycare out of our home the whole time. IN MY OPINION...if it sounds to good to be true, than it problably is!! Remember...this is my opinion!
“(a trusted someone who was not connected with your business) would have to document it and vouch for it. (This is the way in which products are tested -- encasements, pesticides.)”
That is why in another thread I posted I will provide treatment to 1 person here for free. This person will have child concerns, money issues, or has been let down by another PMP.
As for getting people at this moment to “vouch” for me. This is not possible as I stated I work for somebody now. I have put my notice in that I am leaving. And I will not contact their customers out of respect. I have invested $30,000 plus setting up my own company that is about to open once I receive my business License from The Department of Environmental Conservation. (all this is on a part time level as I have a full time job in another profession as well) That is the single last piece of paper I’m waiting on.
Folks, my claims are hard to believe to you because you don’t see people like me try and solve your problem. This industry is scary at best when it comes to competence, compassion, etc. I go to seminars and overnight trade shows and see this industry when they are out of uniform. I can’t even tell you how many business owners and techs are getting high rather than networking or going to training classes some of these places offer. If this industry didn’t need to get recertification credits to keep your license, you would not see 85% of the people you do at any training seminar.
As for the reports in the news, from other companies, and from Entomologists, they are reporting the results taken directly from the techs in the field. Or of course a lab study. I can’t stress to you enough you don’t have many techs who are real problem solvers. The number 1 problem for owners in this industry is employee retention. While others are doing whatever it is they do on their time, I’m reading, studying, reading some more, and then when I’m done reading, I read again. I have books in my library that techs who make scrap change for a living will not buy. Reading the books Entomologists read, study, or train on. Reading books on building types, materials, etc. etc. I have a passion for problem solving. I will not let a bug defeat my intelligence or my will to do the best job I can.
When I started working in pest control I was given 12 to 17 jobs a day to complete. I pushed myself as hard as I could to make the boss happy but realized this was impossible to do. I told them either I’m doing something wrong here or you just want me to wave at the house as I drive by and toss the bill out the window. I can’t interview the customer, do an inspection, educate the customer, do the service, explain again to the customer what to expect after treatment, and again listen to the concerns the customer may have even after treatment is done, and leave in the time allowed.
So, that brings us to Techs working on commission or lousy wages or both. They have to push out as much work as they can to make money, cheap bosses who will not pay the techs well. You have an angry tech for the most part unhappy in life because he can’t make the money he knows the boss can afford to pay him. This is the guy who does the drive by. Hello I’m here, yeah sorry to hear about that, spray here spray there … have a nice day.
Again you read on the net, news, etc, and hear about other companies not solving problems because either the boss will not equip the techs with the proper knowledge, tools, time, and wages for them to do, or want to do the right job. This service does take hours, and then more hours. Most bosses will not let you do that. TRUST ME I see it all the time. I will not let anyone do that to me. I can’t solve problems they don’t see on their timeline.
Again as for techs in this field, I can tell you stories and stories of the types of people I come across in this industry. I can tell you about going to do Bed Bug treatments (The third service for one person) and see someone’s life turned upside down because they gave 3 samples of bugs to techs with maybe 15 years experience combined, misidentify a aphid as a bed bug (smashed on a piece of tape) but also looked at through a high powered electric microscope. I pull out a $40.00 30X loop and tell this person that none of the bugs here are bed bugs. Identify it as an aphid by the antennae and other parts I recognize from my education. (Purdue and Cornell University also if I may ad) You don’t have bed bugs. After my 1 ½ hour inspection. Their 3 full bed bug treatments and thousands of dollars later. This person tossed out cloths, furniture, had her children sleeping at another location. This and many other reasons is why I do what I do. I am not typical, the news or entomologists are not reporting on my single treatments. You read and learn about the industry as a whole. This is why I am opening my own business.
As for self treatments trying to rid your problems. Most of you are going to fail because you are uneducated in the business of killing bugs! No nothing about chemicals! You take matters into your own hands and make problems worse for yourself, and the industry. I understand some have been frustrated by PMP’s or landlords that don’t solve problems. So you think you are forced to take matters into your own hands. You find info on the net that is not accurate, here stories on the news that are not accurate, follow directions from people who are clueless. As you fail with your treatments you put your health at risk, this is why the pest control industry is regulated by more authorities then most any other business around. You expose the pest to chemicals that the manufacturers spend millions of dollars on for professional use. This will limit the products for effective treatments now and the future because there will only be so many compounds available that the scientists can use that will work in the future. You are going to have to hope chemical companies will invest to bring new products to the market. When chemicals are misused they don’t make long term profits. They will not invest the millions of dollars it takes if they don’t have an effective product in distribution with the results professionals expect. With techs doing poor treatments, tenants doing self treatments, this is a problem. A BIG TIME! It’s scary on this site reading some of the things I see here. I will not even get into it on many threads because I can’t stand typing. But people are applying chemicals wrong, and others are encouraging them to do so. I make enough money on my other job that I don’t need to do this for a living. I live pretty much on the upper class level of society with 1 income over 6 figures. I do my part time thing because again I enjoy using my mind and hands to do work and solve problems in the field. I can’t really give you any more info then that really. I know other techs who read this may hate what I have written. But I don’t walk around in life with my eyes closed. I call it as I see it.
I agree it sounds like you do a lot of things many PCOs won't do.
I am glad you are offering to treat an individual in need. It's a great offer, very generous, and I am sure someone will appreciate it.
The report of one person alone would not really verify your claims of 97% success. If you start your own business, then I am sure in good time --through many reports, not one-- we will hear if your success rate really is that high. Good business people will get more business due to word of mouth.
Good luck to you.
FYI, though-- my position, and the official policy of this site-- is that doing it yourself is generally not a good idea. Apparently you haven't read the FAQs. I think it's unfair to speak as if most people here are doing their own treatment-- that's certainly not what I am reading.
Thank you Nobugs. And yes I have not read over all the FAQ's here. I'll work on the FAQ pages tonight.
Doing your own treatment. Most people I believe have and are using professionals but that alone obviously in most situations is not enough so people dealing with infestations must take matters into their own hands and continue the battle after professional treatments. This is where I believe individuals must steam, vacuum, apply DE and yes even some pre-mixed chemicals such as Bedlam. Pest control companies can only do so much especially since bed bugs are showing a great resistance to pesticides and it takes more effort to eradicate bed bugs from a premise and that effort will come from the individual.
Killer Queen- Although most of what you say seems well-thought out and is generally helpful, it is very hard to read in a 'one long book no paragraphs format'
Also, I don't really think an aphid looks like a bed bug and I don't think many techs would confuse the two.
That's just my opinion.
And as I sit here and think more about what you said, let me tell you a little bit about myself.
My neighbors have bed bugs. I am moving relatively soon but am TERRIFIED the bugs will spread to my apartment. Basically, I think that if ALL (which is a broad statement to make) bed bug infestations could be solved in one treatment, most would be. I know that if I got them I would want them out ASAP, just as majority of the people on this website and people I know would.
But, really, there doesn't seem to be any 'one-time treatment' available, and I am curious how your treatment tackles eggs, which to my understanding, hatch like 2 weeks later and aren't killed very easily (and honestly I haven't completely read everything you have written on here, so maybe I missed that step).
I don't mean to discredit what you are saying, I just don't think there would be so much paranoia (on my end) if this was a bug that could be exterminated easily, especially in one visit. That's all I think.
...And I also think I hate these bugs because although I don't have them, I lie awake at night wondering and waiting and checking for bugs, and even that is exhausting. My heart goes out to all of you who are dealing with infestations.
All I read about or see is people or pest control companies that are doing basic treatments, or people applying products wrong. Yes the results you see and read about will be less then what you hoped for because the methods used are not going to solve problems.
I have done many many many treatments and return for follow-up inspections and treatments & I just love the answers from people that tell me nothing since you left. I'm sorry to say I'm at the point where I don't care if you believe me or not. The things I have posted here were to try and help people. Sorry you have had sub-standard companies or lousy uneducated landlords putting you through hell.
As for the paragraphs - each time I type a comment I do space it with paragraphs but when I hit the send post button, it just bunches it all up as if I didn't do it. If you could tell me what I'm doing wrong I'm all ears.
ahh that looks better =)
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