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'Powerful Attractant' as a pre-treatment?

1. 

   Grateful for Help
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Tue Jan 11 2011 23:12:28
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   Hello all,
   I was talking with a PCO, continuing my research to find someone to help me out,
   and he said something I haven't heard before...(not that I've heard tons...)

   He said I would be required to pretty much move everything into the center of each room, including opened clothing ziplocs, and that the technician would then put down a 'powerful attractant' to draw the bugs out, and then use insecticides to kill them.

   He said total time out of the house would be 4 hours...but that it wouldn't really need to be THAT long, probably more like 2, but 4 to be safe.

   Now, I am FAR from being a PCO, so is there such a thing as an attractant so powerful that it would draw every bug out from every bag and crevice of my home, so it would cross poison and be killed in a couple hours, and then I could shut all the bags again as he said? Maybe I misunderstood.

   Wouldn't that just mean I had to retreat all clothing, everything in bags, because they were opened to potential little crawlers for 4 hours? I wish I knew whether I'm being told true or hokey things. If this sounds like a viable treatment option, if anyone has tried it, I'd love to know how it went.

   The company treats three times at 1 week intervals, with one week break between 2nd and 3rd treatment, 30 day guarantee.

   Also, he said my car was fine because it is so cold outside these days. I've heard that is not true. Is that true?

   Confused, for sure.
   Thanks so much!
   -grateful for help

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   bed-bugscouk
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 2:22:13
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   Hi,

   Powerful attractant? That's a new one on me and I think it is were about I would have heard of it.

   I know the car info is 100% dubious so I think you might have to chalk this one up as sounds too good to be true and not based on sound scientific principles.

   I am always open to being proved wrong but it would be the first time when it comes to efficient bedbug treatment.

   David Cain
   Bed Bugs Limited

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   DougSummersMS
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 4:59:33
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   CO2 is a primary attractant, but I am not aware of any evidence that a 2 - 4 hour release would be of any value during treatment... A live sleeping human is the most potent bait currently available...

   Maybe a tech sleeps on the open bags...

   I would be extremely skeptical... There is no published research... It really sounds like an unethical sales pitch that is taking serious liberties with the words "powerful attractant".

   Post a link to their website and we can evaluate their claims more specifically

   I know that David follows this research very closely... The fact that he is unaware of any commercial product on the market strongly suggests that it is bogus

4. 

   bed-bugscouk
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 12:12:52
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   I saw thinking about this more last night and this morning.

   The only thing I can think they might be trying is to follow a research presentation that someone from Florida has been pumping around. They basically found that bedbugs can be attracted to CO2 from a cylinder, nothing new there.

   Sadly they did not do enough research to realise that in order to be attracted in this way the bedbugs must not have fed for a few days. In my replicates I found 7+ days without a source of food gave the best results which in real terms render the concept less effective that other active monitors such as the Beacon which gives the best results within 3 - 5 days from a source of food being in the area.

   It may just be another case of an academic spending too much time in the lab and forgetting that the rest of us live and work in the real world. Its also not his worst idea either.

   I would love to hear more about what this PCO recons they are going to do because outside of what I have described above I am at a loss as to what they could do.

   David

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   Richard56
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 12:51:45
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   In many states (maybe all?) PCO's are required to give you a list of what they use to treat prior to treatment. In any event, why don't you simply ask them what they are going to use, including the "attractant". I'd then seriously evaluate what they say before allowing them to treat, especially if it involves opening previously closed bags of clothes which I assumed were washed and/or heat treated in the dryer.

   Richard

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   cilecto
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 13:49:27
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   What everyone above said. Additional thoughts. Things often get garbled as they pass from person to person. We've heard of PCOs who use substances to "flush" BB out of hiding (ie "attract" them into the open). Could the PCO have meant to describe such a technique?

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   Grateful for Help
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 16:01:05
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   Thanks everyone,

   Richard, Thanks, I didn't know that about getting a list of products...now I am hoping to e-mail him to get a list of products he planned to use. We'll see.

   David Cain,
   Your thoughts make alot of sense to me...I wondered about CO2 as well as an attractant, and it didn't seem plausible.
   You said something about a Beacon being used while people (food sources) are in the house? I thought they were supposed to be used when people aren't present (sorry if I misunderstood). Could I use one in my sisters' room, they both have climbups on their beds. The Beacon picked up NOTHING downstairs, (where my un-isolated bed is). However, I was gone while it ran, for Christmas, and didn't check it every couple days as it suggests.

   Cilecto,
   He may well have meant that, but I still question how that would work, if I am supposed to open and leave vulnerable all my carefully PackTite-ed and Dried clothing. It takes weeks to prep stuff for bags, as we all know. I don't want to redo it for some magic/untrue treatment. Besides, what's the difference in this case between a 'flushing agent' and an 'attractant'?

   My real problem with it it that it seems very cavalier treatment of possible collateral damage to tell me to open all my carefully sealed clothing, and not to worry about spreading it to the house next door, and that my car is probably fine because it's cold. If I followed that advice, I'd be back to square one and not caring about my neighbors at all! Can we all say 'Ep-i-Dem-ic' together now?

   DougSummers, ha ha, yes, perhaps they SHOULD sleep on the job...but I'm sleeping here, and no bites for over 5 weeks, and my bed's not isolated...and I can't possibly imagine someone yummier than my humble self...
   I'm a little leary of posting names of companies, since I am still researching. Would that be harmful to their business? Or since it's just a private opinion maybe it's ok if we post results of research here?

   Anyhow, I cannot tell you how much I appreciate all of you for helping us sufferers. I know everyone says that, but it's true!

   -Grateful for Help
   P.S. I'm in a bind, because he also told me to forget anything I've read about these on the internet or elsewhere, so any advice you've given I won't be able to consider anyhow (sarcastic eye roll :wink:)

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   cilecto
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 16:42:06
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   Grateful, from what I've read in this forum, there are several approaches to bagging.
   1. Bag to seal up bugs for 18 months. This seemed to be prevalent pre-pack tite. It does not appear to be your PCO's approach.
   2. Bag treated items to prevent reinfestation. I don't see the point of opening these.
   3. Bag untreated items pre treatment (likely just to get them out of the way and give the PCO access to drawers) then reopen after treatment, so that BB exit to feed. Perhaps this is what your PCO is trying to do. Again, confirm with him if it's really necessary to open bags of treated items.

   There are also PCOs who don't require bagging or minimal.

   And if your gut doesn't trust this guy, go with your gut.

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   Grateful for Help
   

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   Posted 2 years ago
   Wed Jan 12 2011 17:04:23
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   Thanks Cilecto,
   I did ask him that, specifically about treated bags, cleaned and dried ziploc clothes and he said 'yes, leave them open in the middle of the floor'. I asked if he would spray fabric/clothing and he said no. I inferred from that that the attractant and and poison would supposedly kill anything in those bags? I asked should I then rewash all that already cleaned stuff, and he said only if I wanted to get rid of the remains of the bugs that would be dead by then. (sounds more like fumigation/vikane results !!!)

   I spoke with him about drawers of dressers (all empty because we've already cleaned and ziploc-ed things) and they are supposed to be out on the floor (makes sense) but he didn't mention any other drawers, like kitchens, dining room cabinets, he told us to leave that furniture alone, which seems weird.
   Yep, go with the gut.
   Thanks again.
   -GFH

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    cilecto
    

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    Posted 2 years ago
    Wed Jan 12 2011 17:46:30
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    Based on what I've seen (again other people's experiences in the forum), some PCO's will skip kitchens, or treat less aggressively, as that's not where people hang out motionless, therefore (unless you have a really bad infestation or dispersed bugs with bombs) not a place where bugs will camp out. That said, my own instincts say to consider any atypical situations (like, if you store dirty laundry in your kitchen).

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    bed-bugscouk
    

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    Posted 2 years ago
    Wed Jan 12 2011 21:42:05
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    Hi,

    Just to clarify I did not mean to imply that actives should be run with people in the area. You need to think of all active based monitors as substitute attractants that are used in the absence of people. Non of them are designed to have an output that would compete with a human sleeping in the room.

    I still cant work out what these guys might be trying to do but given that they say its unique and not to trust what you read online I suspect its likely to be snake oil.

    David

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    Grateful for Help
    

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    Posted 2 years ago
    Wed Jan 12 2011 22:34:23
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    Oh, thanks, David,
    That's what I thought about the active monitors. I appreciate the clarification. So, I guess good ol' human bait is still the best!

    Also, Cilecto,
    That makes sense about kitchens and rooms less aggressively treated, and though I don't store dirty laundry there, my 'laundry room' IS in my dining room, attached to the kitchen.

    -Grateful.

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    tforms1
    

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    Posted 2 years ago
    Fri Jan 14 2011 18:27:40
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    >In my replicates I found 7+ days without a source of food gave the best results which in real terms render the concept less effective that other active monitors such as the Beacon which gives the best results within 3 - 5 days from a source of food being in the area.
    >

    Not the most practical, but maybe PCOs should add - "Leave home for 1 week before we come treat"

    This way the first night after treatment, ALL the BBs will be hungry and come out to bite you, so they will cross over the poison.

14. 

    bed-bugscouk
    

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    Posted 2 years ago
    Sat Jan 15 2011 4:34:06
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    Hi tforms1,

    Not really a practical idea but it has more logic too it than the research that was presented.

    I would rather the world took the view that academics either get out of the ivory towers and see what goes on in the real world or learn to actually check their research in the field before standing on stage and goofing off. A little more digging about leads me to believe that this academic is not only a supreme idiot but that he has been this way for some time (at least 4 years).

    Having been to a number of bedbug meetings now I can safely say I have learnt little or nothing new other than the fact that some academics in the US need to learn the basics of bedbug biology before they declare themselves leaders in the field and that a lot of them need to get their fingers out of the cookie jar.

    Thankfully there are a core of good ones who I am sure will continue to shine head and shoulders above the ones who are just jumping on the trendy bandwagon.

    OK its late and although I am now in the city that never sleeps I need a little before the sun comes up.

    David

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