Got Bed Bugs? Bedbugger Forums » Tales of Bed Bug Woe

Poor family, massive infection

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  1. yohoki

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 4:40:15
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    It started out simple. A relative passed on and had a nice recliner that my in-law couldn't live without. 5 years later, we've since burned the wretched furniture... but sadly, the bugs still linger.

    I'm at the point where I can't sleep at night, simply because I feel every bite and it wakes me even from the deepest sleep. Being the sole income of the house, this is quite taxing. I find myself almost falling asleep every day at work. I wonder to myself if I'm stuck living the rest of my life with these creatures. I need out!!!

    So, I thought maybe the biggest bed bug forum might have ideas for a poor family that's living paycheck to paycheck. It's gotten so bad, I don't know that a DIY solution is enough. I'd hate to buy anything only to waste what little money I have on something that isn't going to work. But I'm also tired of waking up and seeing these pests all over my children. It kills me to see the endless streams walking to and from the beds and know there's little I can do to stop it.

    So, let's try and find a solution together! What can you experts, and others, tell me about getting rid of a heavy infection like mine? Here's some few details about the situation.

    We've had these bugs almost 5 years now. Yes, we're 100% sure by now that they're bed bugs.

    We live in a small house, and own it. 3 bedroom, one living room and a small kitchen/laundry room and 2 small bathrooms. I can't say the exact size of the house, but it's not huge. I can probably find out if I really need to.

    Every room is infested. Bathrooms are a safe haven, but they'll still pop out and bite you if you take too long on the pot.

    Money is scarce. I can't stress this enough. By the end of the week, I'll be broke. Every time. So saving up is my only option, but it'll be very slow. Even without internet, tv, etc. We don't have a lot of money to spend.

    The car is definitely infected, too. I'm pretty cautious when I leave the house, and check my kids thoroughly. But no matter what, there's always some in the car.

    There are 6 people in the house. 3 are children and one is an elderly. So, any chemicals must be safe for any age group. We have a cat, but it's an outdoor cat and doesn't come inside, so pet friendly chemicals aren't an issue. (And really, I don't like this cat myself... it bites at me. So forget I mentioned any cat.)

    We haven't tried any treatments recently. When the issue was first appearing, we tried buying a steamer. Unfortunately, this steamer was a waste of money. It was little more than a glorified water spritzer. The water was cool enough to not even hurt your skin straight on the nozzle and simply made everything damp.

    We're in the Tulsa area of Oklahoma, if anyone from the area knows the local companies and services.

    It's also been VERY hard to keep our problem a secret. The first few months, we had gone to help clean our (then)recently passed relative's house to sell. Someone happened to be coming in for some reason and were absolutely appalled in the house that we knew was infected with bugs. And when we mentioned that it wasn't an issue because we had already gotten infected, she threatened to call child protective services. I won't let then take my kids because someone brought these pests into my home! I don't think they can, but it's worried my wife and I for years that if anyone found out, they would come. So, we've quietly lived in secret with these pests for years, unsure of how to get rid of them.

    I think that's about all the basic info I can give to say how bad our situation is and give a picture of everything. I look forward to seeing any ideas anyone has. Thank you in advance for any advice! We're just tired of living like this and don't know where else to turn without feeling like the outcasts... I'm sure many here probably know the feeling.

    Notable sites for my reference (and others that are interested):
    http://www.pctonline.com/article/pct0814-silica-gel-research-bed-bugs/
    http://www.bed-bugs.co.uk/tbypmr.pdf (PDF file. May prompt download)
    Http://www.bed-bugs.co.uk/ (David's company website.)
    Http://www.bedbugger.com/forum/
  2. Norestnosleepnopeace

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 6:39:38
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    I know the feeling. I'm up right now, two weeks after putting down DE and the little fuckers are still coming onto my bed. I have to get up in the morning. I'm forced to deal with this myself because my landlord is a fucktard and the pest control company he's using are full of bigger fucktards.

    I've had bed bugs in every single apartment I've ever lived and never had this problem with a pest company not being able to get rid of them. I too am short of money, just changed cities, wanted to improve my life, and I have an all-over-the-place work schedule and I'm already fed up after living here one month. I want to punch my landlord every time I see him.

    After this, no more apartments for me, that's it, I'm done. If I have to live in my car, I will do it, rather than live in an apartment ever again. I actually envy homeless people anymore.

  3. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 6:54:38
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    Hi,

    Dealing with bed bugs does not always have to cost large sums of money, if you are willing to put in the hard work that professionals provide as a service its feasible for an organised house with a solid plan to tackle the issue.

    Its not going to be fast but if it has taken you 5 years to get to this stage you can expect that it may take a few weeks or a few months to resolve the problem you have.

    What I would suggest is that you start to look at this in terms of what resources you do have. Start listing them from time to vaccuum cleaner to simple DIY tools like brushes paint and varnish.

    Once we know what resources you have to draw upon we can help direct you towards a solution that is likely to work.

    However, if you rent your property you need to check locally to see if the landlord is responsible for pest control.

    Hope that helps.

    David Cain
    Bed Bugs Limited

    In accordance with the AUP and FTC (legal requirements) I openly disclose my vested interest in Passive Monitors as the inventor and patent holder. Since 2009 they have become an integral part in how we resolve bedbug infestations in domestic and commercial settings. The patent numbers are GB2463953 and GB2470307.

    I also have a professional relationship with PackTite in that they distribute my product under their own branding. I do not however receive any financial remuneration for comments I make about products which are all offered because of their technical merits.
  4. yohoki

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 13:15:39
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    bed-bugscouk - 5 hours ago  » 
    What I would suggest is that you start to look at this in terms of what resources you do have. Start listing them from time to vaccuum cleaner to simple DIY tools like brushes paint and varnish.
    Once we know what resources you have to draw upon we can help direct you towards a solution that is likely to work.

    I have a few resources I can list, definitely.

    Trashbags --- duct tape --- a little leftover paint (not enough for the whole house. Maybe a single room) --- wood stain (indoor and outdoor, a few cans) --- paint brushes (some bristle, some sponge) --- basic cleaning chemicals and supplies (sorry. Not at home. Assume I have it, if not I can probably get it.) --- woodworking tools (we can make anything from new tools to new furniture in the garage. Basics like screws and chisels to advanced tools like a table saw) --- a few movable lights and lamps --- tin foil --- hair dryer --- clothes drier and washer --- oven --- soldering gun ---- sewing thread and needles

    It occurs to me as I'm writing this that I really don't know what supplies I have that might be useful. Cleaners of course. Trash bags. But after that, I'm just kinda listing things I know are laying around the house because they're useful for other household problems.

    But, in listing this I get some ideas... ideas they may or may not be safe at all, but I'm willing to tinker with. Here's an idea I just had. I know heat is deadly to the bugs. I'm wondering if anything I have can be made into a heat gun. Maybe a lamp and some tin foil, maybe the heating element from the hair drier or just funnel the air into a small tube to concentrate it?

    I'm thinking the trash bags may work to cover the beds if I tape them good and tight and do a couple layers for redundancy.

  5. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 13:19:55
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    I am not going to disagree with David, but five years is a lot of bed bugs and if at all possible, it may be best to get a knowledgeable pro in. I'm not saying you can't do it yourself, but it would take a lot of physical energy and strength and a lot of persistence, at minimum, along with tools and skills and knowledge.

    I started and run the site but am "not an expert."
  6. yohoki

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    Thu Dec 1 2016 13:37:55
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    It also occurs to me I didn't mention furniture. We have a small house, so we decided to mark and remove most of the seats. We only have one recliner, which is going to be difficult to clean. Other than that, the few chairs we have are just wood. We have a few beds and a crib. We do have dressers and cabinets and a small table for the tv. Not much else that's really big enough to mention / worth keeping.

    I also forgot to mention the vacuum cleaner. It's bagless, though. So any cleaning with it has to be put in a bag and tied immediately.

  7. yohoki

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    Thu Dec 1 2016 13:50:17
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    Nobugsonme - 19 minutes ago  » 
    I am not going to disagree with David, but five years is a lot of bed bugs and if at all possible, it may be best to get a knowledgeable pro in. I'm not saying you can't do it yourself, but it would take a lot of physical energy and strength and a lot of persistence, at minimum, along with tools and skills and knowledge.

    Your very right. I cannot read a sentence without having to stop to pluck several off again.

    I'm aware that it'll take a lot of work, and time, but if that's my only option, it'll have to be done. I plan to call a professional too to get a quote, but I'm positive it'll be more than a couple month's paychecks, if I put 100% of my pay into saving for payment. Obviously, that's unrealistic.

    I appreciate your concern and insight. As for tools and skills and knowledge, what can you, or others, gift to me to aide in my fight? If a professional is unrealistic or unattainable, I will have to fight on my own. If I only cull their numbers in half, I'll consider it a win for now. If I only clear one room, I'll consider it a win and fortify it. If I kill the bugs, but have the eggs return later, I'll consider that sort respite a win for now. If I have to suffer for another month, another year, before it slowly kills them all, I'll consider that a win.

    But before I can do anything, I should learn where to start for such a big infection.

  8. bed-bugscouk

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    Thu Dec 1 2016 15:13:42
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    Hi,

    Yes, I agree that with an advanced case professional help is the best option but if it is not an option in this case we have no choice but to work with what we have.

    The next step of what would be to understand exactly what you have done to date in terms of treatments. This is a lot more vital than people give it credit for as it helps to remotely work out the extent of the issue.

    It will also help for you to collect some images that confirm the level of infestation in the property.

    The good news is that so long as you are methodical and structured each bed bug you physical remove with the cleaner or onto tape is one less to worry about.

    I would suggest that when you have the data together and a better list of your resources we should chat on Skype so I will know what is missing and what I may be able to encourage some suppliers to make available to you out of goodwill and the value of me owing them a favor.

    Its not an easy way to proceed but it is feasible if there are no better options.

    David

  9. erupp

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 15:54:59
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    I'm also new to this forum, but wonder if your county extension office would have any suggestions or resources. Given that this scourge is more prevalent than most think, wouldn't it make sense for extension offices or health departments to provide things like diatomaceous earth to those who can't afford it?

    Also wondering if there's a clothes iron out there with a low enough setting to use on wooden surfaces.

  10. yohoki

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 16:23:41
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    Erupp:

    As far as I can tell, my state says that since they pose no health threats (don't spread disease), they're staying out of it. There may be some kind of help, but I can't find anything about it.

    David:

    Thank you for your help. I really appreciate this. I can provide pictures of our nightmare, but it'll have to be at a later time, as I'm at work. I'll still try to respond to all your points that I can. I'm on mobile, however, so it's difficult to use and I might miss one. Let me know if I do.

    Previous treatments:
    Basically... nothing. We tried using steam at one point, but the machine we got was tiny and not near hot enough. It didn't even hurt when spreading directly on skin. We recently had one of the kids run into lice at school, and purchased a louce/mite/bedbug kit. It contained a spray that said it worked on bed bugs. I sprayed on a heavily infested area of a bed and have noticed no change. I will try leaving a live bug in a jar with said chemical to test if it actually works. I'm skeptical. Other than that, only squishing and washing clothes.

    Images I can do, but not at the moment. I'd prefer to keep it private, as well, so I'll simply message them to you if you don't mind. Anyone else that requests, I can pm you if you need it.

    I do have tape. Is there a method to trap them into it? I tried to surround one on the wall with tape one, to test it, and the bug would not step on it. Instead, they would always simply let go of the wall and fall away. They absolutely refused to step on the tape I set.

    As for Skype, I do not have internet at the moment. I can definitely do a message or email, but my internet and phone minutes are very limited.

    Goodwill is appreciated, but I also intend to pay what I can. I realize that my predicament is probably one of the worst case scenarios and isn't an easy, or quick, fix. But, I'm also not so proud to deny any help given. God bless you guys for any help I get. Encouragement, support, knowledge or physical. I'm already in your debt.

    And as for supplies, before I go counting how many plates and bowls I have available, maybe a general idea of what kind of things I should look for? What might be helpful? We have a lot of tools and things in the garage because my in-law pretty much has a woodworking shop in there... there's no room for the car.... So, if it's at hobby lobby, I might have it in there. Caulking, sealant, paint, stain, gloss. We have a surplus of clothing that can be used for rags and what not if needed... they're to probably be thrown out anyway. I'm also not afraid to tinker with things... if you tell me to make a laser out of a dead nine volt battery and a few paper clips, I'll try my best. I myself am very technical, so I have wires and such for computers that I can use as well.

  11. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 1 2016 16:28:07
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    I would defer to David on the treatment advice, because he's the expert and also because mixing and matching approaches isn't a good idea. You're in good hands!

  12. yohoki

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    Fri Dec 2 2016 3:34:45
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    Nobugsonme:

    Thank you. You're the owner of site, correct? You would know who to trust, so I'll definitely keep an eye out for David's advice.

    David:

    I sent you a pm, only to read afterwards that you don't like PMs. I have very limited options when it comes to internet, but I can send emails. Would you mind if I emailed you?

  13. bed-bugscouk

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    Fri Dec 2 2016 12:21:52
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    Hi,

    I have replied via PM as there is a lot of discussion we need to have here and it does need to be at least part in verbal form.

    Lets set an aim for getting this under a lot more control for Christmas and hopefully starting new in 2017.

    David

  14. yohoki

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    Fri Dec 2 2016 14:11:28
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    Alright. I emailed you various ways to contact me and my times.

  15. barelyliving

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    Sat Dec 3 2016 10:46:04
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    David,
    This seems like an ideal case of why not to PM (except for details that the OP wants privacy for, like pictures, and other details). There are plenty of other poor and hopeless feeling families out there. If fighting bed bugs doesn't have to be expensive, even at this level, we would all love to hear about it.

  16. yohoki

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    barelyliving - 8 hours ago  » 
    David,
    This seems like an ideal case of why not to PM (except for details that the OP wants privacy for, like pictures, and other details). There are plenty of other poor and hopeless feeling families out there. If fighting bed bugs doesn't have to be expensive, even at this level, we would all love to hear about it.

    I'll gladly fill you in on the details! Unfortunately, I won't mention everything yet, because some of it has to do with his company's documents for their techs who are treating houses, which I may or may not be able to share. Not only that, but much of it IS about private things: my family, the house's condition, or daily lives, our income and resources available, etc. Please understand that both parties here have a right to privacy, and I really would like that respected, if that's alright.

    I can detail the strategy we've begun, however. I'm very pleased with his service thus far. And we'll be planning more when his office opens again next week. But, in the mean time, I've got a few things going.

    First, we aren't using chemicals. I have too many variables: kids, elderly, animals, etc. So we're planning on using Diatomatious Earth or a similar chemical. This means I need to wear protective gear while spreading it and have a proper tool to use to put only a thin invisible coating. I will also need a proper respirator, not a painters mask or anything. I'll need to do much research on how and where to place it. I'll post links as I find good tutorials, but I'm sure this page already has many about it.

    Secondly, we're removing BBs with vacuuming, for the meantime. Any bug we remove now is one less to deal with later. When the DE goes down, we'll switch to using a monitor to remove bugs, since vacuuming would remove the coating of DE we placed. I won't go into details on this without permission for two reasons. One, it's his company's document and but mine to share without his okay. Two, it's a technique that's meant to handle small infestations when they first appear, not a long standing heavy infestation like mine. If it works, I will definitely be back here to inform everyone.

    Third, we've begun decluttering. This will make it easier for spreading DE and vacuuming. But, removing bugs isn't the primary objective for this part. I work most days, and for most of the day. This is given to my family now, while I'm still making plans with David, to get the family into a mode where they realize that this is the time to fight back. Because I can't do it by myself, my family will be doing much of the work at home. If they're not committed, it won't work. No matter how much advice I'm given. So, to instill a sense of urgency and commitment in my family, they've begun washing most of the clothes and bagging them, or throwing away what no longer fits.

    That's the basic plan at the moment. I'll be in touch with David more this week, we only briefly talked over the phone and I read quite a few documents on various topics about bed bugs. Let me talk with him about what of his I can and can't share, and more in detail about what my plan of action will be. He's currently preparing for a trip, so it may be a bit before I can give you more details on the plan.

  17. barelyliving

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    Sat Dec 3 2016 21:58:55
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    Thanks, best of luck! There really are a lot of us hoping for the best for you.

  18. yohoki

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    Thank you! We're looking forward to the day where we can say we're free of bugs. It's been years since we've had guests, and can't tell them why because of the fear one person gave us. We can't leave the house without worrying that we might spread it to others.... I can't even get my license to drive, because I'm afraid to give them to the supervisor by letting them into the car... just hearing that there other people who understand the kind of fear we have, the kind of life we have to live, is helpful. I was brought to tears when David called me. I simply don't have enough words to say how thankful I am for this forum and the people in it.

  19. FayeState

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    Yohoki,
    I'm glad that David is helping you. You must feel so much better knowing that. Good luck. Please keep us posted.
    Take care.

  20. yohoki

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    Yes, I do very much. A couple members have reached out to help me already, and I appreciate every bit of help and advice. I think the bill of my fight is mental. My case is definitely far from ideal and definitely a case that a professional should be tackling. So I'm going to have to become a professional, myself. Anything I can learn about them, their habits and behaviors, their markings, anything at all is helping me get to that goal.

    I really feel for anyone on this forum who says they see one on their wall, or feel a few bite marks in the morning. I don't want anyone else to end up in a position like mine. So I'll definitely post anything I can about my treatment. Because if something like this can help someone as heavily infested as mine, it can definitely help an infestation that's just starting.

    I also have a very nice camera with some macro lenses, so I'll try to provide some resources to add to the forum, as well as my own success story... because this WILL be a success.

    Thank you for your support!

  21. pigeonpost

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    Your lack of money is obviously a problem here, but I'd say your best bet is to try and concentrate on the beds.

    Divan beds, maybe called something else in the US but those large solid things reaching almost to the floor, and sometimes with drawers in the base, are a bed bug's best friend. Anyone with the faintest suspicion or evidence of bed bugs should ditch their divan bed without delay and in its place buy a simple slatted bed with proper legs.

    So buy or, if you can, make beds with four narrow wooden or iron legs, and place each leg in a stainless steel dog bowl that you keep topped up with water. (If the legs are wooden then cover them with a condom first, or place them in a plastic cup, or else they will start going mouldy and smelly from the damp.)

    That will prevent 99% of the bugs from reaching the bed, provided the bed's occupant never allows a sheet or duvet to trail onto the floor. That may be a tall order, if you have large duvets and are a restless sleeper or like a few drinks before going to bed, but it is vital or you'll be back to square one! If necessary use sleeping bags instead of duvets.

    In case one of the critters does reach the top of the bed, one way or another, you should also melt candle wax into any gaps between the slats. The fewer cracks available for them to hide in the less chance there is for the bugs to remain on the bed and, worse still, start laying eggs.

    Bed bug's instinctively climb upwards when hungry. So occasionally, believe it or not, a bedbug will climb a wall and drop onto a bed from the ceiling. But you can probably prevent that by buying rolls of double-sided sticky tape and sticking a layer round the walls.

    Also, it goes without saying you should buy as much permethryn-based flea powder as you can and pour this liberally round the edges of any carpets and in doorways. As permethryn is very toxic for cats, I'd try and keep the cat out of the bedrooms. Bed bugs are largely immune to permethryn these days, but enough of it gives them a hard time and may kill juveniles.

    Well I hope that helps!

  22. bugged-cdn

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    yohoki is working with David Cain (bedbugs-co-uk), who does not favor isolating the bed. I'm sure yohoki is following the expert advice he's getting from Mr Cain so we should probably avoid giving suggestions that may end up being counter productive.

  23. yohoki

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    pigeonpost - 33 minutes ago  » 
    Your lack of money is obviously a problem here, but I'd say your best bet is to try and concentrate on the beds.
    Divan beds, maybe called something else in the US but those large solid things reaching almost to the floor, and sometimes with drawers in the base, are a bed bug's best friend. Anyone with the faintest suspicion or evidence of bed bugs should ditch their divan bed without delay and in its place buy a simple slatted bed with proper legs.
    So buy or, if you can, make beds with four narrow wooden or iron legs, and place each leg in a stainless steel dog bowl that you keep topped up with water. (If the legs are wooden then cover them with a condom first, or place them in a plastic cup, or else they will start going mouldy and smelly from the damp.)
    That will prevent 99% of the bugs from reaching the bed, provided the bed's occupant never allows a sheet or duvet to trail onto the floor. That may be a tall order, if you have large duvets and are a restless sleeper or like a few drinks before going to bed, but it is vital or you'll be back to square one! If necessary use sleeping bags instead of duvets.
    In case one of the critters does reach the top of the bed, one way or another, you should also melt candle wax into any gaps between the slats. The fewer cracks available for them to hide in the less chance there is for the bugs to remain on the bed and, worse still, start laying eggs.
    Bed bug's instinctively climb upwards when hungry. So occasionally, believe it or not, a bedbug will climb a wall and drop onto a bed from the ceiling. But you can probably prevent that by buying rolls of double-sided sticky tape and sticking a layer round the walls.
    Also, it goes without saying you should buy as much permethryn-based flea powder as you can and pour this liberally round the edges of any carpets and in doorways. As permethryn is very toxic for cats, I'd try and keep the cat out of the bedrooms. Bed bugs are largely immune to permethryn these days, but enough of it gives them a hard time and may kill juveniles.
    Well I hope that helps!

    Lots of good ideas here! Thank you very much! Let me see what I can pull from it quickly.

    The bed is a regular slated bed. I do not have dog bowls, but I will think of what I can do to replicate that. I might make a bowl out of wood and coat it with gloss or something... maybe making a pitfall trap with it. I'll grab a few bugs and test different materials I have in the house to see what they will and won't climb on. I don't know if I'll be able to use this with David's plan or not, though. I'll talk with him about if it'll affect any of his plans.

    Covering grooves in slats and such with candle wax. That's something I can probably do. I don't have candles, but I have hot glue sticks that I use for waterproofing my electronics. That should work the same.

    Toxic plea powder....... do we really need this cat? It's giving me the stink eye right now..... maybe I'll just spread some in the garage to get rid of the ca.... er.... bugs...... yes. Bugs...... giant furry bugs with claws...... seriously, though. We're avoiding chemicals at the moment, because we have elderly and children in the house. If we absolutely must use chemicals, I'll start another thread to find safe chemicals that we know will not be harmful for any age... and I guess also pets...

    I absolutely believe you about the bugs on the ceiling. They do it. I see it. I don't look up at night in the house.

    I do have a sleeping bag, but only one. Not enough to cover the 6 beds. Plus, that would just completely ruin any intimacy. I don't think it's going to work out. XD If I can think of any suitable replacements, I'll post it.

    I think that's all I can pull from this post. Thank you for your suggestions and advice!

  24. frightened

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Sun Dec 4 2016 13:07:24
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    @yohoki. Pls wait for David Cain to continue helping you. You can make the problem worse and cause dispersal if you disturb the bedbug harbourages. David knows what he is doing. It is easy to get carried away and wear yourself out and make things worse.

  25. yohoki

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    bugged-cdn - 16 minutes ago  » 
    yohoki is working with David Cain (bedbugs-co-uk), who does not favor isolating the bed. I'm sure yohoki is following the expert advice he's getting from Mr Cain so we should probably avoid giving suggestions that may end up being counter productive.

    Yes. I will run by any ideas I get with David. If he says not to use them, I will not. Regardless, any ideas are welcome. I don't discourage giving any. In fact, I recommend it. For two reasons.

    Firstly, anything I learn about traps and such gives me more insight into the bugs and their behavior. If I know how something traps them, I can think about how this can be applied in other ways, using other materials. By learning about the traps, I learn more about the bugs.

    Secondly, if it's something that does not interfere with David's plan, he might be alright if I use it in conjunction with his plan. An example would be David recommending a trap to move the bugs. If I place the trap, and then do something like the candle wax above, it might coax them out QUICKER. But, again, I'll refer to David's expert opinion before doing it.

    So, I encourage others to give ideas and advice. Just know that I will be running anything I get by David first. He's the professional, and he's taken the time out of his life to help me. I won't go ruining his aide by doing something counter productive to his methods.

    Thank you for your comment, though. It does bring up a very important topic that I'm sure MANY people forget or neglect. Don't be counter productive to your PCO.

  26. yohoki

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    frightened - 15 minutes ago  » 
    @yohoki. Pls wait for David Cain to continue helping you. You can make the problem worse and cause dispersal if you disturb the bedbug harbourages. David knows what he is doing. It is easy to get carried away and wear yourself out and make things worse.

    Yes. I believe he is planning on relocating the bugs. In which case a pitfall or trap around the legs or other parts would interfere. It would be counter productive for me to use the dog bowl technique if that's the case. I'm not planning to do anything without consulting him first.

    Thank you for your concern!

  27. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Sun Dec 4 2016 16:26:40
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    What do you mean relocate the bugs?

  28. yohoki

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    It looks like we're trying to create an ideal area for them to make their home in, choose enough that they'll explore it on their way to or from feeding. Hopefully, the ones tucked into nooks and crannies in the bed will relocate to this new area where we can either remove them in a vacuum or simply seal the whole trap and replace it.

    I don't know for sure until I talk to David again, but this looks to be the plan from the documents I've been reading. I'll go into more details if he says it's alright, but I won't share his company's documents without permission first.

    So, with this in mind, if I set a pitfall and the bugs start releasing pheromones, it might cause others to stay away from the new home.

  29. FayeState

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    Thanks.

  30. loubugs

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    yohoki - 1 hour ago  » 
    So, with this in mind, if I set a pitfall and the bugs start releasing pheromones, it might cause others to stay away from the new home.

    If they are in a pitfall, do they really think they are in danger and release alarm pheromone? No. If stuck on tape and stressed? Could be. Low levels of the pheromone (there are various components to the entire amount of chemicals released) are attractive to bugs.

    Professional entomologist/arachnologist. I consult on all matters dealing with insects and arachnids, including those of natural history and biology to pest management and forensic entomology investigations.
  31. yohoki

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    I merely used pitfalls as an example, (and apparently a bad one XD ) substitute for any suitable trap that might interfere with other methods. :p

  32. NaturalHeartsIvy

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    I don't think you can get rid of an infestation this bad by yourself, but, as long as you are careful with the fumes, it might be satisfying to reduce their numbers with 91-99% isoproyl alcohol. Also, some say coating yourself in Vaseline before bed helps.

  33. yohoki

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    NaturalHeartsIvy - 2 hours ago  » 
    I don't think you can get rid of an infestation this bad by yourself

    Noooo don't say that! XD

    We know this isn't going to be quick or easy. It's going to be difficult and we're going to have to be bait for a little longer. But for all the response we've gotten, I can't just not let it work. Too many people have given us advice and a shoulder to lean on. If I give up, it would be like I spit in their faces.

    We WILL win this battle.

  34. yohoki

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    David's given me the ok to share the document about treating with monitors. The document is called "Treatment by Passive Monitor Replacement" (TbyPMR)
    http://www.bed-bugs.co.uk/tbypmr.pdf

    Basically, we'll be placing several monitors in key locations. These monitors will attract bugs passively (without the use of chemicals) simply by providing them an ideal home. Routine checking of these monitors and removing bugs, or the monitor itself, will start trimming their numbers.

    The goal is to get every bug to live in these monitors. For light infestations that are just starting, This method should prevent outbreaks. In my case, it's going to require some trial and error and time.

    My phone's dying, so I can't go into more details, but the pdf shows about everything.

  35. bed-bugscouk

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    Hi,

    Yes I am aware this is a tough case. It's not ideal but it is feasible to deal with.

    However, as it's a big job I need data and time to plan the strategy. This means collecting data from yohoki and creating something bespoke to this home.

    Please respect the fact that this is complex, will take time and it's best done with experience. Yes I do mean some comments are better saved for another day, in part because while I am sitting at an airport I dont have time to correct the details.

    However, I can confirm yohoki will be sharing into once the project is underway and the case resolving so please be respectful and patient till then.

    David

  36. Unsure0817

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    Yohoki, I like your spirit. Don't listen to the naysayers. I've been reading this site for a long time. Neither David nor any of the experts would tell you they could help you if they couldn't. Good luck! Looking forward to seeing your progress!

  37. FayeState

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    Mon Dec 5 2016 14:53:49
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    David gives all of us hope.

  38. FayeState

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    Mon Dec 5 2016 14:54:23
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    Yohoki, do you have the monitors yet? Where are you putting them?

  39. yohoki

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    Unsure0817 - 2 minutes ago  » 
    Yohoki, I like your spirit. Don't listen to the naysayers. I've been reading this site for a long time. Neither David nor any of the experts would tell you they could help you if they couldn't. Good luck! Looking forward to seeing your progress!

    Thank you for your support! Every good word helps. I will try to keep updating as I can. I want to keep a log with photos if I can, and as I can. I want to be detailed to help myself, also to help other users on this forum.

    If i can find a way to keep them still, I might add some 4k photos of the bugs with a macro lens.

  40. FayeState

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    Mon Dec 5 2016 16:55:20
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    Yohoki,
    Have you set up the monitors yet?

  41. yohoki

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    Not yet. We're waiting for a shipment of them and still making the plans with David. Once they get in, I'm sure he'll instruct me to place them and where a good location might be.

  42. yohoki

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    I'm sorry. I didn't notice you asked where they were going to be placed.

    We have 3 beds, a play pen and a recliner to treat. I don't know how many I'll be getting in a package, so I'll have to plan around how many I have available.

    For one bed, it may go on the head or footboard under the box spring.

    For two of the beds, they're next to each other and will probably be close enough for one to be enough. The bed frame is slotted, so it can go on the underside on one of the slots.

    One area is a playpen. It's against a wall, so it might go directly in the lower part of the pen, or on the wall.

    Lastly, the recliner. Probably the best place is on the underside of the footrest, so that it's inside the chair when not reclined.

  43. yohoki

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    loubugs - 2 days ago  » 

    yohoki - 1 hour ago  » 
    So, with this in mind, if I set a pitfall and the bugs start releasing pheromones, it might cause others to stay away from the new home.

    If they are in a pitfall, do they really think they are in danger and release alarm pheromone? No. If stuck on tape and stressed? Could be. Low levels of the pheromone (there are various components to the entire amount of chemicals released) are attractive to bugs.

    I'm curious how accurate this is. I did a test a few days ago. I left a plastic bowl on the ground that they cannot climb out of. After one night, I had captured several bugs, about 1cm worth. After several nights (it's been 3 now) the level of bugs has not risen.

    I'm by no means an expert, but I'd say that they feel stressed from not being able to find a proper home or food. The stress is probably causing changes in their pheromone signals, causing other bugs to think this is an undesirable area.

    In fact, even the area above the bowl is not as infested as it once was, the numbers of bugs has significantly dwindled since I placed this bowl below it, although I'm sure part of that is because what was once there has fallen into the bowl.

    Thank you for giving me the idea to try it. I enjoyed this experiment and would love any feedback I can get.

  44. KillerQueen

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    Wed Dec 7 2016 16:33:20
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    Damn!!! I'm late joining the party but I wish you the best of luck. I would of offered my services free of charge if you were in my area. I hope you get to put this all behind you soon enough.

  45. yohoki

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    Thank you the support! I'm also hopeful to soon put this all behind me. It's been a long time since it all started. Before I came here, I had been thinking that we might just have to live the rest of our lives with them. Just in these last few days, this forum's completely changed my mind.

  46. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Wed Dec 7 2016 17:29:12
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    Yohoki,
    Glad you found the forum. What made you decide to search for it when you did?

  47. yohoki

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    I had known about the site for quite some time. I had searched a few times, but been too scared to say anything to anyone. The first person we told about bugs had threatened to call child protective services on us, and that fear lingered. For almost 5 years we've told no one about it because of that one person.... I didn't even want to call a PCO because of it. I just didn't know who to trust.

    I don't know what made me decide to finally create an account. I just knew that if anyone could help, this forum was the place to start. I'm so glad I did.

  48. FayeState

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    Wed Dec 7 2016 19:14:05
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    Good decision to post. Hope your problem is solved real soon.

  49. yohoki

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    Thank you. I'm going the same. David's wanting me to have this ready by Christmas time, hopefully having a fresh start in the new year.

    Here's an update for where we're at now, for anyone interested.

    We've been decluttering and prepping. We're cleaning and drying ALL clothes and fabrics. All of these are going straight from the drier into bags and sealed tightly.

    We're keeping about 7 sets of clothes to wear for the next few months. These are still going through the washer and drier. I'm not sure if they're being bagged or not. I'm waiting on David to reply back. These 7 sets are going to be our clothes for about a month, hopefully. I'm pretty lucky, I really only wear one shirt and two pants... you don't know how nice it is to not have to worry about what you're going to wear tomorrow. :p

    While we're doing cleaning, we're also giving each room a good vacuuming, and some furniture as well. After vacuuming, the vacuum (bagless) is dumped straight into a trashcan and that trash bag tied and taken outside into the bin.

    We're also eyeing anything that looks washable. Kids toys, backpacks, shoes, door to door salesmen, etc. If it fits, it gets put in the washer and drier. I'm wondering if even some electronics can be wrapped in a towel and given the heat treatment in the drier. (Thoughts, anyone? Would electronic toys and things work in the drier? Does washing and drying rid the house of salesmen? They're about as annoying as BBs)

    Prep work almost out of the way, we're almost ready to begin riding the house of BBs. I'll make sure to jeep (ummm... Keri? Kerri? Leo lei loop key kelp Loreto..... WHY IS "KEEP" NOT IN MY PHONE?!?!) ... as I was saying... I'll make sure to keep updating and keep everyone informed on how the situation is.

    Hopefully my story can help others in similar situations. Those with little money that can't afford treatment. Those that have had these critters for a long time. Those that are scared to talk openly about their situation. Those that are thinking that this is just how they'll have to live for the rest of their lives... all of those were me just a few days ago. So really, thank you all for your support.

    Hopefully, someone else in my position might see this thread and sign up as well.

  50. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Wed Dec 7 2016 23:35:26
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    Yohoki,
    Great what is going on. Are you noticing less bugs yet? How do the kids react to all this?

  51. shunter

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    Hi David,

    I'm far from an expert but I have had to improvise on a budget to get my house back from these pesky creatures. Here is a tip: use steel dog bowls, pots, pans, etc. to put under the bed legs/wheels and move the bed away from the walls. I poured cooking oil into each bowl. Not full, just enough to cover the bottom of the pan. Also make sure the legs/wheels are in the middle of the pan so they have to fall into the oil to get to the post.
    I have not been bit in months now, thankfully.

  52. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 8 2016 0:24:01
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    Shunter,
    So you're rid of the bed bugs? What kind of cooking oil? Did it hurt the legs of the bed?

  53. FayeState

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    Thu Dec 8 2016 0:24:43
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    So does David predict you'll be bug free by Christmas?

  54. yohoki

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    Thu Dec 8 2016 2:31:01
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    shunter - 2 hours ago  » 
    Hi David,
    I'm far from an expert but I have had to improvise on a budget to get my house back from these pesky creatures. Here is a tip: use steel dog bowls, pots, pans, etc. to put under the bed legs/wheels and move the bed away from the walls. I poured cooking oil into each bowl. Not full, just enough to cover the bottom of the pan. Also make sure the legs/wheels are in the middle of the pan so they have to fall into the oil to get to the post.
    I have not been bit in months now, thankfully.

    Yes. This method will protect your bed from getting infected to begin with, but doesn't really stop the ones already living there. Plus, they also drop down from the ceiling, so it won't be very effective in my case. But thank you for the advice. I'm glad to see it worked out for you! I wish mine were this simple!

    FayeState - 1 hour ago  » 
    Shunter,
    So you're rid of the bed bugs? What kind of cooking oil? Did it hurt the legs of the bed?

    Any liquid will do. The bowl is a trap that they can't climb out of, the liquid is only there to kill them. Most metal beds, oil shouldn't hurt but might rust in water. Water will damage wood frames, but I don't think oil will. To keep it from damaging it, put a condom or balloon around the leg where it touches the liquid and you should be fine. Keep in mind, if you're using a condom or balloon you should use water based liquids, as oil damages the latex. Better safe than sorry. It really sucks to wake up and find your condom busted and your frame was impregnated by the liquid.

    FayeState - 1 hour ago  » 
    So does David predict you'll be bug free by Christmas?

    That's what it's sounding like, from our brief talks. We live in almost opposite time zones, so communication is pretty brief. But, if we get set up as soon as possible, I think it's definitely in the realm of possibilities.

    Even if not completely clear, we should see their numbers drastically decline by then. That alone will be an immense change to the current pace. Even if I get woken up one every night, that's so drastically different from my current situation, where I'm woken up every 10 minutes or so.

    FayeState - 2 hours ago  » 
    Yohoki,
    Great what is going on. Are you noticing less bugs yet? How do the kids react to all this?

    Very good questions. I haven't really done anything yet to start dwindling their numbers. I DID change my youngest's bed arrangements so that they aren't able to climb on her bed any more, so if anything I've made myself a bigger target by reducing a food source. Probably a bad thing, but it breaks my heart seeing even one on her.

    As for the kids, they haven't really known anything but this. My oldest was still newborn when this started. They don't really seem to notice them much, except saying "daddy, there's a bug on the wall" or something like that. Their bedroom seems to be less of a target than mine and the living room.

    That doesn't mean that they aren't affected by it, however. My daughter does mention every now and then that she has an itch, but she's the only one that can speak in sentences. And I can see that they have bites here and there. They don't seem to notice being bit, though. I think I'm the only one that can actually feel the critters biting as they're still latched on. Apparently I'm sensitive enough that I can tell the difference from a nymph and an adult biting. But, since they don't notice being bit, it's not waking them up at night.

    They are excited to help clean if you make it a game or fun somehow. That's an important part, especially when cleaning up their toys, else they just get them all out again just as fast as you can put them away.

    I plan to have them help in most steps, keeping them involved in the process. They can help vacuum and put clothes into bags. Later on I'll be spreading DE or Cimexa, however. That may just be a job for dad. (We might put some in a jar with a few bugs though.... That sounds like a fun experiment! And maybe we'll get to watch a couple suffer after all they did to us! Bwahahahahahahaaaaa! Revenge!)

  55. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 8 2016 2:47:30
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    That will be a really great Christmas - I am glad David has been able to help you so much. You seem like a great dad - I understand what you mean that you rather be bit than your daughter and since your children are very young they love to help.

  56. yohoki

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    Definitely. And I would totally rather be bit myself. If I see even one (we share a room until she's a little older), I have to walk over and squish it. As for loving to help...I wish. They will complain the entire time unless bribed with high fives and shiny things...

    Edit: I don't know why I felt the need to quote. Removed.

  57. FayeState

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    I know David's monitor can be used for monitoring. But how does it relocate bed bugs and to where? And, how do these bed bugs get killed?
    Thanks.

  58. yohoki

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    Good question! I'd love to answer that!

    The bugs are curious creatures, like many things in nature. If they see something new, they explore it. If it just so happens to look like a better hiding space than their current living arrangements, they move in.

    The monitor does several things. I'll go over each real quick.

    1. It provides an ideal living area. It's hidden, dark, and provides a nice comfy area for our guests. This entices them to stay in it if they come exploring.

    2. It's close to their host. Nobody likes a long commute to work, bed bugs are no exception. Placing it close to their food is good for them, but also increases the chance that they'll see it going to or coming back from feeding, encouraging them to explore it.

    3. I'm not entirely sure how, but the skirt on these seems to entice them to defecate on it. It may simply be because it's close to their home. Either way, defecation is essential for young nymphs, as they feed off of it, and it's known to attract more bugs.

    4. As bugs live in it, everything they do will attract more bugs. Other bugs want to live with other happy bugs. So each new bug makes it more likely to attract even more bugs.

    And that's how we plan to relocate the bugs. Right now they're scattered. Some live in the mattress, others in the box spring. Some at the foot, some at the head. Others don't even live on the bed. By placing the monitors in ideal locations, we gather them up from they're current unorganized state into a very centralized area, giving us only one area that we need to attack.

    That explains the relocation part, but you also mentioned killing them.

    For most people, they'll set these monitors when they are not infested. This is simply to alert you that you're not infested. When you start seeing signs of a new infestation, they'll hopefully all be inside the monitor, in which case just throwing out the old monitor may rid you of your infestation. Simple as that. Just replace it and you're good to go. Hotels would benefit greatly just by having one in each room.

    But, since I'm not just a simple case, we have other plans.

    Partly, we'll be vacuuming them up. I'm sure these monitors will get very full, very quickly. It should be easy for me to vacuum them out every few days, or maybe once a week. Since they're gathered in such a small area, it minimizes the amount of searching we have to do to effectively remove them.

    We're also going to be using either DE or Cimexa, but I'm not sure how yet. My gut tells me that we'll be treating the floor, to encourage them to take up residence inside the beds, instead of elsewhere. But, until David is back from his trip, I'm not 100% sure.

    I hope that was informative. Please ask any other questions you may have. I'm more than happy to answer any as some of them I hadn't thought of yet, like yesterday when my wife asked me what to do with the clothes that we were going to be wearing during this treatment.

  59. Bbgoaway100

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    Yohoki I have been reading up on your story since it started and I just wanted to personally say that I am so happy for you that you started posting here and are getting help and on the way to rid of these suckers! I look forward to your updates and one day your success story! And I do believe yours will help others as well!

  60. yohoki

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    Thank you for your support! I'm very much looking forward to reading my own success story, as well!

  61. bugnut

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    Thu Dec 8 2016 20:46:08
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    Yohoki -

    I think you are tough cookie to handle this on your own. My FIL told me he had bedbugs as a kid and they removed them by hand and by treating the baseboards with kerosene (NOT RECOMMENDED!) Good thing we have better and safer options now. It is a tough thing but amazing when the whole thing is behind you. I am sure David will instruct you how to properly inspect anything coming into your house from now on.

    Best of luck to you!

  62. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 8 2016 21:12:29
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    Yohoki,
    Am I remembering correctly that you have a school age child. If you don't want people to know about your bed bugs, how do you get your child to not discuss it? It is my experience that kids tell everything and sometimes even preface it by "My mother said not to say this" and then say it.

  63. yohoki

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    bugnut - 35 minutes ago  » 
    Yohoki -
    I think you are tough cookie to handle this on your own. My FIL told me he had bedbugs as a kid and they removed them by hand and by treating the baseboards with kerosene (NOT RECOMMENDED!) Good thing we have better and safer options now. It is a tough thing but amazing when the whole thing is behind you. I am sure David will instruct you how to properly inspect anything coming into your house from now on.
    Best of luck to you!

    When I helped bring the infested recliner into the house, I had never heard of bed bugs before. I, like probably many other people, thought the little night time jingle was just nonsense to scare little children.... little did I know how bad it would scare this adult! But kerosene? How did they not burn the house down??? I guess we'll really do anything to get rid of these guys.

    FayeState - 12 minutes ago  » 
    Yohoki,
    Am I remembering correctly that you have a school age child. If you don't want people to know about your bed bugs, how do you get your child to not discuss it? It is my experience that kids tell everything and sometimes even preface it by "My mother said not to say this" and then say it.

    I've never told her not to mention it. Maybe that's why? But it probably also has to do with the fact that it's been the norm for her. She hasn't really known anything BUT living with them. Their room also has been fairly light, compared to the other bedrooms as well.

    I do know if I tell her not to talk about it, she absolutely will, though.

  64. FayeState

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    Thu Dec 8 2016 21:41:42
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    Glad theirs is lighter. Did it stay lighter because you did laundry?

  65. bugged-cdn

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    I'm not entirely sure how, but the skirt on these seems to entice them to defecate on it.

    I seem to recall reading that they defecate on the skirt to make squeezing into the cardboard tubes easier.

  66. FayeState

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    Thu Dec 8 2016 22:07:11
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    How would defacating on the skirt make squeezing into the tube easier?

  67. yohoki

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    FayeState - 52 minutes ago  » 
    Glad theirs is lighter. Did it stay lighter because you did laundry?

    I'm not sure. It's probably because of their sight. If I recall correctly, they see in ultra violet (or maybe infrared?). In that light, carbon dioxide appears black, so when we breathe out, they see a large black cloud. I assume that in my room, with two adults, they see a huge black cloud and know there's food. In the children's room, there was only one child for several years, so it would have seemed a smaller black cloud, therefore less tempting than the huge one coming from the other door.

    I assume this is why active monitors are effective, because their black cloud of CO2 is able to overpower the CO2 being produced by the people.

    bugged-cdn - 42 minutes ago  » 

    I'm not entirely sure how, but the skirt on these seems to entice them to defecate on it.

    I seem to recall reading that they defecate on the skirt to make squeezing into the cardboard tubes easier.

    FayeState - 35 minutes ago  » 
    How would defacating on the skirt make squeezing into the tube easier?

    That makes sense to me. They balloon up a lot when feeding. If they're too fat to fit into the tubes, they could simply defecate and shed some weight before squeezing in...I understand completely... I too feel the urge to poo after a trip to a buffet, else I may not fit in my belt any more! David! You didn't get the idea to make these traps at a restaurant, did you sir? :p

  68. Bbgoaway100

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    Yohoki, no problem! I do have a question for you. Do you ever notice BBs in your children's toys?? I have 4 young children in my home, which is currently infested, i THINK lightly, though we are in treatment and taking measures. With so many kids, there are many toys. And that is a huge concern for me. I have done many visual inspections on the toys, and don't see anything, but then again, so many toys have many different holes or slits making it just almost impossible to see what's inside!

  69. yohoki

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    I don't really see anything on toys they actively play with. If I find that a missing toy had been under a bed or behind a dresser, etc., I'll sometimes see bugs. And I noticed that a plastic dump truck toy would have bugs in it, simply because they crawled over it and couldn't get back out.

    I think that toys are not a very good home for bugs. It looks like they avoid areas that are moved around a lot. I mean, imagine if your home was on a different street every morning before work, sometimes right side up, other times on its side. I think they prefer places that are more out of sight and not moved often.

    The very few times I've seen bugs on toys, it's because we left them in a bad area, or they just happened to be walking over the toy to get to where they needed to go.

  70. Nobugsonme

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    Sun Dec 11 2016 20:23:25
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    Yohoki,
    I sent you a private message!

  71. FayeState

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    Wed Dec 14 2016 17:08:50
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    Yohoki,
    How is the treatment going?

  72. yohoki

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    Awaiting packages. Within the next few days I should be getting Cimexa, a respirator and some passive monitors.

    Clothes are almost all laundered and bagged.

    We've also been eating lots of green leafy vegetables to increase our iron, because low blood = low energy.

  73. yohoki

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    I'm also going to try helping some of the community as well during my treatment.

    David has found some researchers interested in live samples.

    Loubugs has also given me advice on how to get the bugs to sit still long enough that I can use my 4k camera and macro lens to take photographs. I'm sure there's probably much better equipment that's been used, but it doesn't hurt to have more. Plus, since I'm taking them myself, I can specify that Nobugs has full rights to use them on the forum and the blog.

  74. loubugs

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    NaturalHeartsIvy - 1 week ago  » 
    I don't think you can get rid of an infestation this bad by yourself, but, as long as you are careful with the fumes, it might be satisfying to reduce their numbers with 91-99% isoproyl alcohol. Also, some say coating yourself in Vaseline before bed helps.

    Actually not a good idea at all. Vaseline is a bit messy and the isopropyl alcohol can kill on contact but can be repellent. It is also flammable. You don't want to do 2 types of bed bug remediation that counter each other because you will be making the bed bugs move around due to unnatural behavior then it's difficult to predict their true behavior.

  75. loubugs

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    bugged-cdn - 6 days ago  » 

    I'm not entirely sure how, but the skirt on these seems to entice them to defecate on it.

    I seem to recall reading that they defecate on the skirt to make squeezing into the cardboard tubes easier.

    The amount they defecate doesn't appreciably reduce their size to fit it the corrugations. There's enough room to let them in.

  76. loubugs

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    yohoki - 1 week ago  » 

    loubugs - 2 days ago  » 

    yohoki - 1 hour ago  » 
    So, with this in mind, if I set a pitfall and the bugs start releasing pheromones, it might cause others to stay away from the new home.

    If they are in a pitfall, do they really think they are in danger and release alarm pheromone? No. If stuck on tape and stressed? Could be. Low levels of the pheromone (there are various components to the entire amount of chemicals released) are attractive to bugs.

    I'm curious how accurate this is. I did a test a few days ago. I left a plastic bowl on the ground that they cannot climb out of. After one night, I had captured several bugs, about 1cm worth. After several nights (it's been 3 now) the level of bugs has not risen.
    I'm by no means an expert, but I'd say that they feel stressed from not being able to find a proper home or food. The stress is probably causing changes in their pheromone signals, causing other bugs to think this is an undesirable area.
    In fact, even the area above the bowl is not as infested as it once was, the numbers of bugs has significantly dwindled since I placed this bowl below it, although I'm sure part of that is because what was once there has fallen into the bowl.
    Thank you for giving me the idea to try it. I enjoyed this experiment and would love any feedback I can get.

    Your are thinking like a person and not a bug. If you think not having a place to harbor is a problem, just give them small folded pieces of paper. The fold becomes a good place for them to stay in. The reason for no bugs there after is that there aren't many crawling about at that time. Low levels of the pheromones are attractive. If you grab one on the leg with a forceps you will smell a heightened level.

  77. yohoki

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    So the strong pungent smell is their pheromones? I didn't know we could actually smell it. I'll sometimes smell a really strong foul smell when I try to squish one and thought it was just the blood, etc. Is this the pheromones I'm smelling?

  78. loubugs

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    yohoki - 6 minutes ago  » 
    So the strong pungent smell is their pheromones? I didn't know we could actually smell it. I'll sometimes smell a really strong foul smell when I try to squish one and thought it was just the blood, etc. Is this the pheromones I'm smelling?

    Strong, pungent smell might be differently characterized by different people. Smells like coriander, cilantro, citronella to me. An infestation, in addition to live bugs, has dead ones, lots of fecal droppings, other wastes, so the musty or rusty smell is derived from oxidized iron in blood. Dead insect and dead bug bug odor is something else. If you pick up a fresh shed skin, you will also smell their odor because the nymphs have dorsal abdominal glands as opposed the the active thoracic glands in the adult bugs. See this picture and read the accompanying info.
    close-ups of 3 shed skins of 5th instar bed bug nymphs by louento.pix, on Flickr

  79. BBuster

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    If the bedbugs are not resistant to chemicals, you save a lot of money with doing the treatment yourself. You need a tank (ca 100$) and chemicals eg K-Othrine (ca 150$) .

    If they are resistant you have to remove them manualy.
    Remove as much wooden furniture and replace with cheap plastic furniture.
    Remove any carpet. Encase and seal all mattresses.

    Cook clothing, beddings, towels... instead of washing them, use a large kettle on a single pit on the floor. This will save tons of water and money. Wash everything after every single use.

    Steam iron your clothing and put it in a freezer if you can find one.
    (try freecycle groups in your area for these items)

    Vacuum vacuum vacuum. Your house, yourself, your hair, everything.
    Shave whatever you can shave from your body.

    If you ever can afford the bedbugpyama, buy it, it's a lifesaver.

    For me: cooking clothes, vacuumclean and the BBpyama did the job ( 3 years).

    Good luck.

  80. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 15 2016 15:06:11
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    Lou,
    Why do they defecate on the skirt?

    loubugs - 1 hour ago  » 

    bugged-cdn - 6 days ago  » 

    I'm not entirely sure how, but the skirt on these seems to entice them to defecate on it.

    I seem to recall reading that they defecate on the skirt to make squeezing into the cardboard tubes easier.

    The amount they defecate doesn't appreciably reduce their size to fit it the corrugations. There's enough room to let them in.

  81. loubugs

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    Thu Dec 15 2016 15:56:31
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    FayeState:
    "Why do they defecate on the skirt?"
    I have them on folded paper so there isn't any skirt prior to them entering the folded paper. They defecate on the paper. If David used a dark colored skirt, you wouldn't easily see that they have defecated and entered.
    Image 4- 1st, 2nd, 3rd instar bed bug nymphs by louento.pix, on Flickr
    Image 3- 1st, 2nd, 3rd instar bed bug nymphs by louento.pix, on Flickr
    Image 2- Now 2nd & 3rd instar bed bug nymphs by louento.pix, on Flickr
    Image 1- Now 2nd and 3rd instar bed bug nymphs by louento.pix, on Flickr

  82. yohoki

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    FayeState - 2 hours ago  » 
    Lou,
    Why do they defecate on the skirt?

    It may simply be that it's an area close to the nest. If I'm not mistaken, the young nymphs eat some of the blood from fecal, so it's beneficial for the colony to have fecal near the nest.

  83. yohoki

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    BBuster - 3 hours ago  » 
    If the bedbugs are not resistant to chemicals, you save a lot of money with doing the treatment yourself. You need a tank (ca 100$) and chemicals eg K-Othrine (ca 150$) .
    If they are resistant you have to remove them manualy.
    Remove as much wooden furniture and replace with cheap plastic furniture.
    Remove any carpet. Encase and seal all mattresses.
    Cook clothing, beddings, towels... instead of washing them, use a large kettle on a single pit on the floor. This will save tons of water and money. Wash everything after every single use.
    Steam iron your clothing and put it in a freezer if you can find one.
    (try freecycle groups in your area for these items)
    Vacuum vacuum vacuum. Your house, yourself, your hair, everything.
    Shave whatever you can shave from your body.
    If you ever can afford the bedbugpyama, buy it, it's a lifesaver.
    For me: cooking clothes, vacuumclean and the BBpyama did the job ( 3 years).
    Good luck.

    I like the cooking clothing idea. I'm not sure how much my wife will, though. We could easily just use the bathtub. I'm sure I could fill it easier with hot tap water, then put a few buckets of boiling water into it to raise the temp. That might be enough to kill them, but I could dry them after to be safe. That, at least would bypass the electric for the washing machine and allow bigger batches at once.

    The encasements I cannot do, though. The treatment we're doing needs us to be bait, so using encasements would simply spread the infestation to other places, like my kids' room or elsewhere that they find us throughout the day.

    Thank you for your ideas though. I may seriously give that cooking idea a go in the bathtub.

  84. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Thu Dec 15 2016 19:05:38
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    Lou,
    I saw your pictures with folded paper, what is the paper sitting on?
    Thanks.

  85. FayeState

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    Thu Dec 15 2016 19:07:04
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    Yohoki,
    Under David's procedure, how do the bugs ultimately get killed, since the traps do not make them stay inside?
    Also, where did you read that the young nymphs eat the fecal matter?
    Thanks.

  86. yohoki

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    FayeState - 53 minutes ago  » 
    Yohoki,
    Under David's procedure, how do the bugs ultimately get killed, since the traps do not make them stay inside?
    Also, where did you read that the young nymphs eat the fecal matter?
    Thanks.

    We'll simply be disposing of the monitors in Ziploc bags to remove the bugs inside the monitors. Others will be killed with the Cimexa as they crawl around it. Others will be vacuumed and bagged tight.

    So, I guess you could say the majority of deaths will be through starvation/oxygen deprivation in a landfill. Others will die a painful death of having their flesh melted off, or at least their waxy coating. And the few sent to researchers will be probed to death, alien abduction style. :p

    About the fecal matter.... I'm not quite sure, I had read that several years back when I was first trying to read about them... I can't seem to find any other mention of it, so maybe it's completely false. I don't believe I've seen and nymphs having problems feeding off me, but I see them less often, so I had just assumed it was true. Maybe one of the experts can tell us if it's true or not?

    Experts? Do the first few stages eat partially undigested blood from fecal spots?

  87. FayeState

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    Thu Dec 15 2016 20:15:44
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    So there will be ones in the monitors even though they are free to exit them? Are you using a special kind of vacuum cleaner? Where are you putting the Cimexa? Why do the researchers want your bed bugs since I know there are plenty in the world?

  88. yohoki

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    Thu Dec 15 2016 20:33:55
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    FayeState - 3 minutes ago  » 
    So there will be ones in the monitors even though they are free to exit them?

    Yes. They will live in the monitors when they aren't active (daytime usually) and will leave when they go feed. If I bag them during their least active time, I'll get more than if I replace the monitors while they're all out feeding.

    FayeState - 3 minutes ago  » Are you using a special kind of vacuum cleaner?

    A simple canister vacuum. It's better to use a bagged vacuum with HEPA filters (I think that's the acronym?) I only have a bagless vacuum and a small shop vac. So I'll just be emptying the canister into a regular trash bag and tying it immediately.

    FayeState - 3 minutes ago  » Where are you putting the Cimexa?

    Floors near furniture and base boards. I also have a bit of carpet that we had to remove a while back after a slab leak, so I'll put a generous amount underneath the carpet in that area, just in case.

    FayeState - 3 minutes ago  » 
    Why do the researchers want your bed bugs since I know there are plenty in the world?

    Not everyone is willing to send live samples, when it's easier to spray and kill everything. I believe they're doing DNA testing of some kind. Probably keeping track of the various species and how they're spreading throughout the country.... or maybe they're trying to pull my DNA from the bugs to make a clone army! (Queue Darth Vader theme)

    I'm gonna guess it's the first two, though. :p

  89. FayeState

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    Thu Dec 15 2016 20:53:37
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    So as soon as you get the traps you'll put them out? How long did it take after you brought in the recliner for you to realize you had bed bugs?

  90. yohoki

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    We didn't realize very quickly. We had thought we cleaned it good. Obviously our cleaning standards were not up to par with what they needed to be. They didn't spread very quickly from the chair, or at least we didn't notice them. My wife had seen then before, because she had been to the house the recliner was in, bit I had never heard of them, so I didn't know what to expect. I'm sure I thought the first few bites were just mosquito bites.

    And yes, we do plan to put the monitors up immediately. Probably the Cimexa, too.

  91. FayeState

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    Fri Dec 16 2016 3:18:22
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    Are the monitors coming from England or are you getting them locally? When are they suppose to come? I'm very interested in hearing how it goes for you.

  92. loubugs

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    FayeState - 13 hours ago  » 
    Lou,
    I saw your pictures with folded paper, what is the paper sitting on?
    Thanks.

    Plastic caps from plastic vials in which the folded paper stays. These aren't monitors, just small rearing containers.

  93. loubugs

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    BBuster - 18 hours ago  » 
    If the bedbugs are not resistant to chemicals, you save a lot of money with doing the treatment yourself. You need a tank (ca 100$) and chemicals eg K-Othrine (ca 150$) .
    If they are resistant you have to remove them manualy.
    Remove as much wooden furniture and replace with cheap plastic furniture.
    Remove any carpet. Encase and seal all mattresses.
    Cook clothing, beddings, towels... instead of washing them, use a large kettle on a single pit on the floor. This will save tons of water and money. Wash everything after every single use.
    Steam iron your clothing and put it in a freezer if you can find one.
    (try freecycle groups in your area for these items)
    Vacuum vacuum vacuum. Your house, yourself, your hair, everything.
    Shave whatever you can shave from your body.
    If you ever can afford the bedbugpyama, buy it, it's a lifesaver.
    For me: cooking clothes, vacuumclean and the BBpyama did the job ( 3 years).
    Good luck.

    It seems very labor intensive than what others have done and no need to throw out so much furniture. Don't have to cook all clothing, the washing machine works. If not dirty, can use dryer alone. Isolate what has been washed/dried. Who can have a large pot boiling on the floor?

  94. loubugs

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    Fri Dec 16 2016 8:47:59
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    yohoki - 15 hours ago  » 

    FayeState - 2 hours ago  » 
    Lou,
    Why do they defecate on the skirt?

    It may simply be that it's an area close to the nest. If I'm not mistaken, the young nymphs eat some of the blood from fecal, so it's beneficial for the colony to have fecal near the nest.

    Technically there is no nest. It's a harborage. I remember replying earlier regarding the nymphs eating some blood from fecal. No, you're mistaken. Fecal material is dry, bed bugs have sucking mouth parts to imbibe liquid, so this is impossible. It comes out wet and dries. There is no colony even though people refer to the mass of bed bugs as such. Colony and nest refer to insects (in this case) that are social such as wasps, ants, bees, termites. This would be insects that have a caste system of workers, soldiers, reproductives, etc., and there are morphological differences between the castes categories. The harborage has live bed bugs, viable eggs plus dead bed bugs, egg shells, feces, metabolic waste all mixed together. There is no bathroom outside. The feces are attractive to bed bugs; it's like a welcome mat, but there are also lots more feces in the harborage area compared to the white skirt of the passive monitor. Their harborage is the passive monitor.

  95. yohoki

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    So the skirt doesn't really encourage them to defecate, they just happen to, due to the close proximity to the harborage.

    Thank you about the fecal eating. That makes sense. Just a bit of misinformation I had taken as fact.

  96. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Fri Dec 16 2016 12:15:54
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    Lou,

    What are rearing containers? Would this be something that would be good to be near a bed for monitoring?

    Thanks.

    loubugs - 3 hours ago  » 

    FayeState - 13 hours ago  » 
    Lou,
    I saw your pictures with folded paper, what is the paper sitting on?
    Thanks.

    Plastic caps from plastic vials in which the folded paper stays. These aren't monitors, just small rearing containers.

  97. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Fri Dec 16 2016 12:20:20
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    Lou,
    I'm confused. Why do the bed bugs defecate on the white skirt of the passive monitor? Also, isn't it common for them to defecate on the outside of the box spring? Or, am I mistaken?
    Thanks.

  98. loubugs

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    Fri Dec 16 2016 14:34:36
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    yohoki - 4 hours ago  » 
    So the skirt doesn't really encourage them to defecate, they just happen to, due to the close proximity to the harborage.
    Thank you about the fecal eating. That makes sense. Just a bit of misinformation I had taken as fact.

    I don't know what David would say about this since it's his design. The behavior is that defecation often precedes harborage entry. Might depend on harborage design.

  99. loubugs

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    Fri Dec 16 2016 14:37:37
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    FayeState - 2 hours ago  » 
    Lou,
    What are rearing containers? Would this be something that would be good to be near a bed for monitoring?
    Thanks.

    loubugs - 3 hours ago  » 

    FayeState - 13 hours ago  » 
    Lou,
    I saw your pictures with folded paper, what is the paper sitting on?
    Thanks.

    Plastic caps from plastic vials in which the folded paper stays. These aren't monitors, just small rearing containers.

    I rear thousands of bed bugs, some in larger 8 oz containers and some in small vials. You can make folded paper harborage areas and then you inspect them. If you have a room that is occupied by a hoarder, then you have much 3 dimensional space in which bed bugs will harbor. You place monitor devices out so bed bugs will climb in so you can see how the population is. You remove full harborages and you remove bugs from the infested place.

  100. FayeState

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    Posted 1 month ago
    Fri Dec 16 2016 15:27:48
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    Thanks, Lou.


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