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Polti Cimex Eradicator fast and ecological solution to eradicate bed bugs.

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  1. detercenter

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 2 2014 12:34:01
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    [Sales ad deleted]

  2. loubugs

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 2 2014 15:05:58
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    You were in such a haste to post, you didn't read the rules
    http://bedbugger.com/forum/topic/forum-rules-please-read

    BTW - your website:

    After 7-10 days a larva emerges from each egg which is about 1 millimeter and a half long and translucent dirty white in color; it immediately seeks a host to feed on.

    The immature stage is called a nymph, not a larva.

    Professional entomologist/arachnologist. I consult on all matters dealing with insects and arachnids, including those of natural history and biology to pest management and forensic entomology investigations.
  3. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 2 2014 21:23:30
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    Per Lou's response, please don't post ads in the forums. If you want to run ads, you can get in touch with me directly using this form.

    I started and run the site but am "not an expert."
  4. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 2 2014 22:52:06
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    Holy Crap !

    According to one website this unit costs $1,299 to $1,499 each.

    The marketing claim is that this unit produces "super heated" steam of 180 C which is pretty darn hot.

    pjb

  5. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 3 2014 7:06:28
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    Hi,

    Its a shame that this distributor spammed the group.

    I will however confirm that the unit is worth every penny of the initial cost although it is a significant cost for a home owner to factor in although having said that its often lower than some of the prices we see quoted for service.

    The product does produce at 180 C although it is technically a super heated jet of air rather than steam as there is little to no moisture to the output.

    My hotel clients who self resolve their problems use this as the enabling technology for treatment.

    David Cain
    Bed Bugs Limited

    For total clarity and disclosure I confirm that I worked with Polti on its final development and optimization although I was not financially compensated beyond expenses.

  6. cilecto

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 3 2014 8:35:20
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    IIRC, the Polti was long-time forum participant Franco Cassini's (EffeCi) tool of choice. It's a "nice" coincidence when we get spammed for a product that seems reasonable.

    Thou shalt not be afraid for the terror by night...
    - Psalms 91:5-7

    (Not an pro)
  7. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 3 2014 9:54:47
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    Hi cilecto,

    Yes it was Franco that introduced me to them and the base technology.

    We then had a few lovely days consuming espresso and working out which of the 15+ models was best adapted to be the CE. I think we chose well as my original testing unit is still one of the 20+ that we operate in our team and with our clients. The only issues we have had to date have been the occasional blown fuse which considering that some of the units have been transported for 50,000+ miles is in fact more reliable than my mechanical spray tank (not that I have used it in the last 6 months).

    The higher output temperature without the need to "cloth and hold" means you can work at a very reasonable pace and just the other day I got out of a taxi, decontaminated a room (twin beds, previously treated seven times) and was back off site within 60 minutes. Once you get the hang of it you can actually smell the bedbugs being cooked by it and thus can stop and target specific areas.

    It will be nice to see them more readily available in the US, I had a message the other day from someone using it as a solution in developing countries in Africa and getting amazing results.

    David

    I am happy to answer questions in public but will not reply to message sent directly or via my company / social media. I am here to help everyone and not just one case at a time.

    In accordance with the AUP and FTC I openly disclose my vested interest in Passive Monitors as the inventor and patent holder. Since 2009 they have become an integral part in how we resolve bed bug infestations. I also have a professional relationship with PackTite in that they distribute my product under their own branding. I do not however receive any financial remuneration for any comments I make about pro
  8. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 3 2014 11:49:20
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    It will be nice to see them more readily available in the US

    Bring it on!

  9. theyareoutthere

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 3 2014 12:27:27
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    Shoot, I couldn't find it under Polti. I usually won't click on spam. It will be a great tool for the professionals, and I might get one....(hmmmm...need more pap pictures based on my tax refund would not cover it....how ya doing, David? )

    They
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  10. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Thu Apr 3 2014 12:36:17
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    Nobugsonme - 29 minutes ago  » 

    It will be nice to see them more readily available in the US

    Bring it on!

    At this stage I suspect the only thing that could speed it up is more people asking for it. On a personal note I am happy, I now have a box that I can plug into a power supply anywhere in the world and run the one I have. I even have a nice carry case that makes me look like a special agent when I turn up on your doorstep dressed in black.

    David

  11. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Fri Apr 4 2014 7:47:40
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    Actually, when looking at the linked information it was a tad disappointing to see that certain points of "specification" type information were missing.

    While it may be great that this unit produces 180 C, pest pros that evaluate such units when considering purchase are also interested in performance factors beyond peak temperature alone.

    Reportedly these are decent units however, there are many competing units with which pest pros are attaining success and the US market is competitive by nature so, we shall see how this unit performs in the market in relatively short order.

    Have a nice day ! paul b.

  12. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Fri Apr 4 2014 8:17:14
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    Hi Paul,

    Could you possibly be more specific as to what "specifications" you feel are missing?

    In terms of the temperature rating it is actually the only critical factor in the thermal transfer equations that anyone servicing an issue can hope to realistically influence. This is because it is the delta T of the Heat transfer coefficient and as all the other factors are constants in a given environment its actually the only influencing factor.

    The higher the delta T the more penetrating and faster the heating occurs. Even down to a single degree F or C will make a difference that no other factor can.

    As such a unit with identical specifications but a lower temperature will be definition be less efficient at doing the job.

    I personally never found that "wet" or 100C / 212F steamers were man enough for the job if you were looking at a results versus time perspective.

    David

  13. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 15:33:02
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    This is fundament information for consideration.

    Those considering the viability and purchase of such units would want to see similar specification and performance information that is published on existing competing units which are currently available within the market.

    Thermodynamics and its inherent effect on life forms, such as bed bugs, is well established and was never in question for purposes of this discussion.

    However, at 180 C, if in fact this unit delivers that temperature, this unit produces temperatures that are extremely hot at nearly ( 180 C is about 356 F, btw ). As such, there may be concerns regarding damage caused to various materials and surfaces by such extreme temperatures during treatment work as well.

    It is what it is.

    pjb

  14. theyareoutthere

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 16:43:08
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    For both professionals (play nice please):

    If 113 degrees will kill the bedbugs, why is it a benefit to have it much higher? I do understand, from Paul's previous posts regarding using the proper extension cored (not right term but you get my drift) is important or else the steamer would lose power. But what is the benefit of the higher heat?

    I have a steamer, and fell in love with it for cleaning (my spring cleaning time is cut in half and I don't have to buy bathroom cleaners except vinegar and baking soda for one area where the steamer doesn't go. And, I don't use it at the same time.

  15. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 17:16:38
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    Generally speaking we might say that "hotter is better" but, within reason.

    The goal here is to heat the target pest quickly such that it is killed.

    To do this, we have to deliver sufficient heat in such a way that the temperature of key portions of the target body are raised enough to result in the various lethal physiologic effects which cause mortality. For this to occur rapidly requires an efficient transfer of the heat energy from the steam delivery system to the critter.

    As an example, we know that convection heat works better than conduction heat. Additionally, total emersion in a suitable heated media would be more efficient in heat transference than might be any methodology which was "less than" total emersion. Think of it this way for those of you who have done this: how quickly is a live lobster rendered "mort" when dunked/dropped into a large pot of boiling water as compared to a similar lobster placed in a steam only type pot ? Clearly, the boiling water would kill the lobster much quicker and this is so because the lethal temperature is delivered efficiently by the hot water in which the lobster is placed. (What may be difficult to understand is that the cooler lobster body actually absorbs heat energy from the hot water and "cools it" if only temporarily.)

    If we then tried to kill/cook the lobster using hot air alone, it would take much longer comparatively speaking. Right? Good.

    As such, it may be so that the "dryer" our steam is, the less efficiently it is able to deliver and raise the temperature of the target pest. This may be and is likely so because there is simply less substantial mass, if you will, to the heated steam & air being delivered or applied to the target pest and harborage areas where these pests are located.

    In short, the steam with more water within the steam vapor may be more lethal than the dryer steam and likely is, simply due to physics and other factors.

    Of course, a 44 magnum may be a more powerful handgun than, say, is a 38 special however, properly used both will kill the target equally dead.

    And, we can't kill a bed bug twice so, as long as we know what were doing in combination with a sound understanding of the limitations of our tools and equipment, we should be OK.

    This said, nearly any steamer that's working properly will kill bed bugs when used properly.

    Hope this makes sense and helps ! paul b.

  16. theyareoutthere

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 17:39:20
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    That does make sense. But, I bought the dry steamer (or I think I did) because I don't want mold. So, I'd be interested in a higher heat since it is a dryer steamer.

    That's interesting. I kept thinking a wet steamer might just make them "wet" vs. kill. Thanks for the lobster analogy, that really helped!!!

  17. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 21:35:05
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    TAOT,
    A tiny bit OT:
    Do you ever use your steamer to steam something you would otherwise have ironed? I wonder how dry steam does with this.
    Thanks!

  18. theyareoutthere

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 21:47:52
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    Nobugs: I've been afraid to try it. I was going to dry it on some jeans (which I sometimes will iron). I did hang a sheet over the shower curtain once, but I don't remember thinking "ironing is faster and more specific". Have you tried it? I really do love the steamer and use it all the time. My guy friend borrowers it to clean the inside of his car. I only do that about 3 times a year.

  19. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 22:30:45
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    Kids,

    You realize that they sell "steamers" for "ironing" purposes and the sales pitch is that you leave your garments on a hanger and simply steam them with the wand/nozzle because it is much faster than ironing, right ? Good.

    We need to remember that the amount of water that is emitted from such steamers is not as much as we might think. And, since the steam is relatively hot, the water soon evaporates such that moisture related issues are of little, if any, concern.

    As such, "wet steam" may be a tad superior to "dry steam" (which is actually an oxymoron just like "peace-keeper missile" is as there is simply "no way" that steam can actually be "dry") for certain purposes and under certain conditions.

    Insert logic here !

    Hope this helps ! pjb

  20. theyareoutthere

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Sun Apr 6 2014 23:46:09
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    Yes. I don't have one of those. Mine seems too bulky, even with attachments.

  21. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Mon Apr 7 2014 15:00:56
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    Hi,

    Having caught up on this I would encourage anyone wishing to follow this discussion to consult the wikipedia on thermal transfer equations.

    I am not doubting that anything above 60 C will immediately kill a bedbug but the higher dryer temperatures will always penetrate and thus treat more thoroughly and completely as well as at a faster rate than anything with a lower temperature. The ability for heat to transfer through materials or into locations such as cracks and crevices is however restrained by the laws of thermodynamics which is why this is one of those situations where one solution is better than another.

    The only time this will not be correct is if they change the laws of physics.

    As for allowing the moisture to build up to add to the thermal transfer you still do not reach the increased rate of transfer you achieve through a higher delta T value and conversely to our experience with higher temperatures, it is the moisture which causes either the short term or long term damage via mold growth and warping.

    I am to date, yet to see a case where a modern material other than silk had any damage as a result of a correctly used 180 C / 356 F dry steam and that is in the hands of my team as well as numerous hotel staff and domestic users. That is certainly not the case for wet steamers.

    While the lobster pot analogy may seem initially logical the fact is that you have to deliver the heat to the "lobster" in the bedbug setting unless you want to put the whole room in the pot. The correct analogy is to look at how long it takes to get the pot to the correct temperature. The wet steamer would then be akin to the wood fueled fire compared to a gas jet. While they will both do the same job one gets there a lot faster and more consistently than the other.

    It is a matter of one technology is more appropriate as a tool because it has better features. To us a wet steamer is the Windows 3.1, although functional it is hardly consider acceptable when there are better options on the market.

    David

  22. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Mon Apr 7 2014 17:30:39
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    Suffice it to say that steamers are a useful tool in bed bug control but they remain just one of the tools to use.

    Nearly ALL competent pros use a variety of tools just like an ASA A level mechanic has a large toolbox with a variety of tools that he needs and uses.

    Are screwdrivers good tools? Sure they are, when needed and used appropriately.

    However, here we seem to be initiating an argument over which screwdriver is better or preferred.

    Despite this, we need to consider the following:

    > The steam devices we are discussing are for commercial use and not intended for homeowner/layperson use. As the grand majority of the folks on the BBF are non-professionals, this conversation thread is likely an interesting waste of time for most readers. And, this is likely so because it is totally unrealistic to expect that any non-pro would be interested or considering the purchase of a $1,600 steamer and to suggest or advise so would be poor advice to tender to non-pros.

    > Note that there are pro level steamers available for sale at approximately 1/3 to 1/2 the cost of the unit being discussed here. Is the unit being discussed here three times as good as those units? Probably not.

    > If high temperature alone was in fact the best solution then we could simply purchase a heat gun at any well supplied US tool store for under $40 US and be way ahead of the game financially. Such heat guns are capable of producing temperatures of over 500 F and can be had for as little as $7.99 at Harbor Freight tools. However, this does not necessarily make them a good bed bug control tool.

    > With such high temperatures we need to be careful and consider personal safety, the surfaces being treated, glues and materials that could be ruined as well as other such considerations.

    > Are "super heated" steam units the king of the steamer world? Maybe yes, maybe no. But let's not yet crown them so until a sufficient successful track record has been established.

    > What's really needed is a moderately priced steamer which is suitably effective that the average homeowner can afford to purchase rather than another pro model which is way out of the reach of the average bed bug victim.

    > We all know that: "Necessity is the mother of invention." Let's not forget that years ago folks would use boiling water to kill bed bugs because that was one of the options which was available to them. Low cost, non-chemical and effective.

    Again, the use of steam is just one tool and only one of the effective control tools.

    They are merely a facet of the overall bed bug control world.

    So are vacuums, which happen to be way cheaper too.

    Have a great day folks ! pjb

  23. Nobugsonme

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    Mon Apr 7 2014 19:20:50
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    theyareoutthere - 21 hours ago  » 
    Nobugs: I've been afraid to try it. I was going to dry it on some jeans (which I sometimes will iron). I did hang a sheet over the shower curtain once, but I don't remember thinking "ironing is faster and more specific". Have you tried it? I really do love the steamer and use it all the time. My guy friend borrowers it to clean the inside of his car. I only do that about 3 times a year.

    Yes, I have steamed clothing and it was much more convenient than ironing. But that was with a cheapo wet steamer, and it was slow, so I figure it would work better with continuous steam.

    What kind do you have?

  24. Nobugsonme

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    Mon Apr 7 2014 19:26:44
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    P Bello - 20 hours ago  » 
    Kids,
    You realize that they sell "steamers" for "ironing" purposes and the sales pitch is that you leave your garments on a hanger and simply steam them with the wand/nozzle because it is much faster than ironing, right ? Good.
    We need to remember that the amount of water that is emitted from such steamers is not as much as we might think. And, since the steam is relatively hot, the water soon evaporates such that moisture related issues are of little, if any, concern.
    As such, "wet steam" may be a tad superior to "dry steam" (which is actually an oxymoron just like "peace-keeper missile" is as there is simply "no way" that steam can actually be "dry") for certain purposes and under certain conditions.
    Insert logic here !
    Hope this helps ! pjb

    Hi Paul,

    I asked about the dry vapor steam and steaming clothing because I have in fact used a steamer to steam clothing.

    I do know "dry vapor" steam is not actually dry. However, it sounds like I was correct that steam from a non-dry vapor steamer might work a little better.

    Too bad, because my experience has been that they're not very well made otherwise, in terms of how fast they heat up, how long they can run on a tank, and how well the steam is output. The $50 one I had actually dripped, so wetness there was not a plus.

  25. theyareoutthere

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    Mon Apr 7 2014 21:11:00
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    Thanks to both the experts for their comments on this thread.

    Nobugs OT:

    1. I'll have to look it up. I think I have a VC4000-s. I'll have to look: I know that is the website (didn't link) and that it's continuous. I watched until it was on sale, but it was still close to $1,000. Way more than I need. A close friend uses a $200 steamer (looks like a device that would hold an IV bag). She steams her furniture. It is wet. I just don't think that's good. Dry steam isn't totally dry, but it is dryer. I use the wand attachment and the floor attachment a lot.
    2. I still need to take Packtite pictures.
    3. Done with austenland and actually checked out (as in I have it for 3 weeks from library) Midnight in Austenland. It's great being 5 years behind everybody in reading...no pesky wait lists.

  26. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Mon Apr 7 2014 22:12:54
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    Thanks, TAOT!

    A lot of people here have used the Vapamore ($300) which seems to be the low end for dry vapor steam (per the FAQ on killing bed bugs with steam).

    It seems to be one of those purchases where if you can spend more, in some cases you can get a lot more, though it's good to know there are lower cost possibilities.

    Paul said,

    The steam devices we are discussing are for commercial use and not intended for homeowner/layperson use. As the grand majority of the folks on the BBF are non-professionals, this conversation thread is likely an interesting waste of time for most readers. And, this is likely so because it is totally unrealistic to expect that any non-pro would be interested or considering the purchase of a $1,600 steamer and to suggest or advise so would be poor advice to tender to non-pros.

    I read much of the thread pretty quickly but I don't actually see anyone telling consumers they need a $1600 steamer.

    On the other hand, some people have invested in good steamers to treat for bed bugs and are using them years later to clean. One reader back in the day bought a LadyBug (which I suspect is not as good as many options available today) and did her own bed bug treatment.

    At $1200-$1400, she may still have saved money overall. If you can afford it and you're going to be steaming repeatedly, making the process more efficient (with high heat, continuous steam, and a good design) and maybe even more comfortable ergonomically seem like good ideas.

    And while I agree that (like many topics) this topic won't be of interest to many if not most, I don't agree that it is a waste of time. Just because you don't like a product or agree with its recommendation does not mean the discussion is pointless. As others have noted EffeCi (Franco Casini) was the first to post about this product, and many of us took an interest.

    Besides interested consumers, there are also pros here and pros have been known to pick up new ideas from other pros on the site. (And I would venture, there are pros here you don't see posting, just like there are lots of consumers who don't post.)

  27. P Bello

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    Tue Apr 8 2014 0:53:04
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    OK NBs, fair enough.

    > Decent pro model steamers ma be had for as little as about $600 each on the low end and over $2,000 for higher priced models.

    > A $600 model would serve a non-pro well and provide many years of service if properly used and maintained.

    (Unfortunately, over 95% of the folks who contact me for assistance with their bed bug problems can't afford even a low priced steamer.)

    Preferred steamer features include, but are not limited to:

    > Operating pressures of 50 + psi.
    > Continuous fill capability (i.e. the unit can be refilled as it is being used which eliminates down time)
    > Short steam generation time.
    > Large capacity tank.
    > Ability to adjust the water content, or flow, within the steam from "dry" to "wet" steam.
    > Quick steam generation time.
    > Various application attachments.
    > Manufacturer's warranty and service.

    Of the features above, continuous fill is desired and is important because this allows the pest pro to replenish the water as the steamer works all day long. In this way, no time is lost as the unit cools due to refilling and then takes time to reheat to generate steam.

    Hope this helps to explain a tad further. pjb

  28. Butterfly1972

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    Tue Apr 8 2014 8:13:02
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    Nobugsonme - 9 hours ago  » 
    And while I agree that (like many topics) this topic won't be of interest to many if not most, I don't agree that it is a waste of time. Just because you don't like a product or agree with its recommendation does not mean the discussion is pointless. As others have noted EffeCi (Franco Casini) was the first to post about this product, and many of us took an interest.

    Agreed. I have found this post to be interesting. I can remember the Polti Cimex Eradicator being discussed a long time ago on here and have been interested in the unit ever since that time.

    And, actually, I don't ever think of any thread as being a waste of time, or pointless. I usually learn something from each thread.....whether it be a new "it works" way of fighting bed bugs, a "don't do this, it won't work" lesson, a stress buster idea, a new song, or a financial idea.

    And sometimes I just get a nice laugh, which is awesome and useful in itself.

  29. bed-bugscouk

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    Tue Apr 8 2014 8:50:25
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    Hi,

    Actually I rejected a continuous fill model on the grounds that the current tank is enough to process 6 - 8 rooms and frankly if a technician is doing that many in a session without a break their work quality drops to a point where a break is needed.

    In our assessment and according to physics the key criteria is temperature and after that control ability. Many steamers suffer from the same fault as the cyronite approach in that when incorrectly used there is a risk of dispersal of the nymphs.

    After that stage the optimisation moved to more miner points including if the steam wand needed a light for better up close work and what tools and attachments would work best.

    Once you actually get field experience with the unit you realise that the process flow is simple:

    • Confirm infestations
    • Set up steamer and start heating
    • Set up room and start processing items
    • Treat the area
    • QC / QA monitor the process

    At present it is positioned for professional users but equally it is priced at a point which is competitive with many services. In some cases we have seen people could buy the kit and cover their wages for a day or two working on the problem and could still be better off. I am also teaching my cleaner to work with steam in my home so that I will have a cleaner and more chemical free home. At the end of the day most homes only head a vacuum, a steamer and am ample supply of cleaning clothes. When you calculate the savings in sprays and cleaning products you start making profit in about 6 months.

    The only thing that is lacking to make that a more viable option is better training materials with the product but that is actually something we have looked into creating at some stage.

    Its also feasible that some bright spark will work out a rental package with time that encompasses everything that anyone needs to understand and deal with a problem, after all its only a scaled down and repackage version of what we already have been doing with hotels for about 3 years now and have letters of testimony to prove that it works as promised.

    If I felt that would have been an option with a wet steamer I would have done it years ago.

    David

  30. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 9:18:43
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    This is yet another example of how a non US based perspective can be an issue. it's like comparing apples to oranges.

    There are other parameters which come into play that have not been considered:

    > The size of the home, apartment unit or rooms being treated. (The larger the home, the more work to be done.)

    > The number of the above which need to be serviced that day. (At large scale facilities the technician's work is laid out in advance for the entire day and such teams of technicians will have numerous units to inspect and treat in the same day.)

    > The quantity of furnishings present within the location being treated. (Of course, the more furnishings, the more work to be done.)

    Working at large facilities with numerous "units" requires the capacity to work extended periods of time. Under such circumstances, single fill units will cause excessive down time due to the refill/reheat/re-pressurize cycle time.

    If only one or two homes are being treated the capacity of the unit may not be an issue. However, one very wise and highly successful pro advised this: "Remember, that with large capacity equipment you can always do small sized jobs but, with small capacity equipment you will always find that taking on large jobs is tough."

    Best wishes for a bug free day to all ! pjb

  31. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 10:36:24
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    Paul,

    I am not sure why you seem to think that the US is so very different from the rest of the world given that the population is in essence drawn from all over the rest of the world. The falicy of your argument is clear when you consider that we have reports of the system working in different EU countries, different continements and just last week someone posted to a professional forum that they are using the approach in developing Africa.

    I am sure that there were cultural as well as structural issues that needed to be overcome to optimise the solution in those locations but that has been done.

    Now its perfectly fine to be of the opinion that you don't want to try it yourself. Its perfectly fine to try it not like it but to not do either and to discourage others from trying something is a stance I don't understand when you don't have the experience of it to say with any fact.

    The rest of your points are not really valid when you look at the experience of a diverse and cosmopolitan city like London. We do have hones that range from 100 sq foot through to 30,000 sq foot in a range of architectures dating back some 1,000 years with a diverse range of styles.

    Once you teach people to work to a standard rather than following a protocol they can adapt what they do to the environment they are in.

    David

  32. AbsolutelyFreaking

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 11:32:27
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    cilecto - 5 days ago  » 
    . . . the Polti was long-time forum participant Franco Cassini's (EffeCi) tool of choice. . . .

    .

    bed-bugscouk - 5 days ago  » 
    . . . Yes it was Franco that introduced me to them and the base technology.
    We then had a few lovely days consuming espresso and working out which of the 15+ models was best adapted to be the CE. I think we chose well as my original testing unit is still one of the 20+ that we operate in our team and with our clients. . . .

    .

    Nobugsonme - 13 hours ago  » 
    . . . .As others have noted EffeCi (Franco Casini) was the first to post about this product, and many of us took an interest. . . .

    I do miss Franco . . . his sense of humor . . . his knowledge . . . and when he would say his English was broken!!

    EffeCi - 2 years ago  » 
    A rare image of this event...
    David & EffeCi
    (I'm obviously the one with a black T-shirt... lol...)

    http://bedbugger.com/forum/topic/bingo-full-house

  33. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 12:52:53
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    OK.

    Since one of us seems ignorant to the facts or is relatively slow on the uptake, below is posted from a published news source in London, England. (You can find it online and readily available to read too.)

    Additionally, note that I am

    t y p i n g

    r e a l l y

    s l o w l y

    s o

    t h a t

    a l l

    c a n

    u n d e r s t a n d:

    The incredible shrinking houses: The average new British home is now just 925 square feet – barely HALF the size they were in the 1920s
    Average homes 90 years ago usually measured 1,647 sq ft with 4 bedrooms

    Today’s equivalent has only three bedrooms and is a mere 925 sq ft
    Experts say new homes cause poor health, divorces and hold back children

    One-bedroom flat today is on average the same size as a Tube carriage
    Britain also has the smallest houses when compared to the rest of Europe

    By Martin Robinson and Gerri Peev

    Published: 06:16 EST, 21 August 2013 | Updated: 09:04 EST, 21 August 2013

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2398714/The-incredible-shrinking-houses-British-homes-built-just-HALF-size-1920s.html#ixzz2yJcgrtuq
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

    Millions of Britons are living in 'rabbit hutch' family homes that have halved in size since the 1920s, it was revealed today.

    The average semi-detached house now has one less bedroom and is much more ‘cramped, dark and artificially lit’ than those built in the early 20th century.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Of course the article continues to present information on the diminutive sized homes that the folks in England live in and it's published for ALL to read.

    Now, let's consider why this is an issue where bed bug control is concerned !

    My comments for your review and consideration:

    > How small is a three bedroom 925 square foot house? It's so small that you'd half to go outside to change your mind.

    > Is the polti steamer any good? Sure it is but, let's not go hog wild over any such piece of equipment because it's not as if this thing is going to kill all the bed bugs by itself or cure cancer. And, we need to consider the parameters and limitations of each piece of equipment, product and methodology we adopt and utilize for any pest management work, including bed bugs.

    > The average size of a US home is significantly large and this is a factor which effects: work load, supplies used, labor time, production capacity and many other factors.

    > Some US housing complexes may contain over 3,000 units. As such, weekly service may require the inspection and treatment of numerous units per day. When so, equipment performance capabilities and capacities are of key concern.

    > Whereas other folks may state that such factors above are NOT an issue, such assertions are either naïve or ignorant to the facts. Regardless, in addition to being incorrect, such assertions are immaterial.

    > As a consulting entomologist my recommendations for client locations require certain parameters for certain equipment. One such factor is that the steamers used be continuous fill. The most critical factor of consideration for this aspect of the steamer capabilities is the amount of work which will need to be done each day or, simply stated, production.

    > Note that while the "other guy" is having to refill and recycle his steamer which results in "down time" and lost production hours, continuous fill type steamers are still working.

    In side by side field work we've already been there/done that under field conditions here in the US. We have seen how the continuous fill units will out perform the non-continuous fill units about two to one every time. BTW, the units we prefer are also made in Italy.

    > Does being in the US or not really matter ? Does size really matter ?

    Of course it does !

    Here's why: The larger the home the more supplies, steam and labor required to treat it correctly. STOP here and ask yourself if what I'm saying makes logical sense to you folks.

    As you read in the British Press article above, the average sized home in the UK is about 900 square feet. WTF ! The average home in the Cambridge Subdivision is over 3,000 square feet. Our "starter home" was 1,500 square feet. We have studio apartments here that are about 900 sf. Simply stated, larger homes/rooms take longer to inspect and treat than do smaller homes. Anyone who says this is not so obviously cannot be correct.

    Over the past you've all read where I've posted that the US Market is unique and we have certain parameters under which we exist and work which are different than elsewhere. This aspect is another example thereof.

    The US Professional Pest Management Market is different than other markets. It is also the global leader in many ways and there is no refuting that this is so.

    Let's check our egos at the door and be reasonable and honest in the information we present for the benefit of those who actually need it !

    Have a nice day, pjb

  34. KillerQueen

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 13:43:49
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    Too funny!!!

    I'll admit - I'm intrested in the machine (don't remember all the specs on it) but let's keep in mind here folks. It's a machine, period. You still have to do the work.

    I have the hottest steamer on the market I believe - 390 degrees.

    I also have machines that are 1/3 the cost of my 390 degree machine and they work like the rest. They kill bugs.

    I'm a gadget guy so I would be interested in this machine but as noted - it's nothing that will change anything in the bed bug game. It's too costly for most home owners and even some small businesses.

    One major thing I must have is - continuos fill capabilities. I have both types and my larger, single fill machine sits on a shelf in my closet.

    Everything else I've read hear is hysterical and should be listed as OT humor.

    Forgive any typos - on the phone.

    Regards,
    John Furman
    Boot A Pest, Inc.
    New York's "Best Bed Bug Exterminator" NY Magazine

  35. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 14:03:27
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    John KQ said:

    "One major thing I must have is - continuos fill capabilities. I have both types and my larger, single fill machine sits on a shelf in my closet. "

    John,

    Can you explain why the single fill steam unit ". . . sits on a shelf . . ." unused ?

    (Maybe you can rent it out to folks ? )

    pjb

  36. KillerQueen

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 15:13:31
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    P Bello - 1 hour ago  » 
    John KQ said:
    "One major thing I must have is - continuos fill capabilities. I have both types and my larger, single fill machine sits on a shelf in my closet. "
    John,
    Can you explain why the single fill steam unit ". . . sits on a shelf . . ." unused ?
    (Maybe you can rent it out to folks ? )
    pjb

    Simple - while it has a larger boiler for more water, it runs out of water/steam before I can finish a standard one bedroom treatment here in NYC. I don't have time to wait for it to cool down just to open it, then wait again for the water to reach operating temps. When I bought it 6 years ago it had the largest boiler on the market for a portable machine.

    Regards,
    John Furman
    Boot A Pest, Inc.
    New York's "Best Bed Bug Exterminator" NY Magazine

  37. P Bello

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 15:38:03
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    So, wait a minute.

    Are you saying that the refill and recycle time required for a non-continuous fill type steamer is a consideration when doing bed bug work here in the US ?

    Is the size of the rooms, apartments and homes an issue too?

    Hmmm . . .

    It is difficult to understand how these factors can be an issue for you doing bed bug work in NY, when reportedly as asserted by the OP, they are non-issues in Europe and other non-US areas of the world.

    Are you saying that your steamer runs out of water before the treatment work is completed ?

    Are you sure you know how to use a steamer correctly ?

    Maybe it's your NY water, have you tried filling your steamer with Evian or Perrier ?

    Perhaps you should use Pelligrino, after all these steamers are manufactured in Italy, right ?

    OK, all kidding aside;

    At issue is the size of the job and work to be done. If our steamer runs out of water we need to refill. The advantage of continuous fill units is that they can keep working all day if need be. When the tank fill indicator light comes on, we simply fill the tank in a matter of seconds and keep on working.

    Anyone who has steam treated a number of bed bug jobs realizes the value and huge advantage that continuous fill units provide when compared to non-continuous fill.

    It's simply counter intuitive, illogical and silly to disagree with this factor.

    It is what it is ! pjb

  38. theyareoutthere

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Tue Apr 8 2014 17:27:33
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    I appreciate everyone's input into this thread...I'm learning a lot...I think I choose the steamer that I did years ago because of input from this site. I don't buy things often, but when I do...if I can afford it...I research and buy what seems the best for me.

    OT....

    Ummm, I live in 900 SF. It's more than enough room for one person or two if I get the master bedroom closet to myself. 2nd bedroom closet is big enough for most guys. Open concept living room, dining room, kitchen (kitchen is 12 x 10 so not tiny not big and is G shaped). In my city, the new apartments are 650 SF for a one bedroom and 750-900 for a 2 bedroom.

    My friend is in an older building and has a 2 bed/2 bath which is 1,200 SF. It is considered large with 2 large walk in closets.

    The house I lived in before this was a 2 bedroom/1 bath with 700 SF. Tiny 8 X 10 kitchen. And, I'm in the USA. But, I'm an urbanite not a suburbanite. There's nothing wrong with a bigger house, but...if you live in the city, you trade a lot of things (including a smaller space and probably no garage).

  39. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 years ago
    Wed Apr 9 2014 11:28:42
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    Well unless said home is in fact in the tardis I hate to point out the fact that the laws of physics do still apply. In fact they are even more applicable with a larger working areas because the thermal transfer is significantly faster.

    There is a continuous fill option if you married different models up because of the modular nature of the technology used so if that is what is holding you back from making a leap forward and giving it a go I am pleased to have provided the solution.

    May I ask if you and John tag team on other activities outside of the forum? You do seem to have developed something of a high fiving "bromace" of late and while I think its great to see people reach out and find love online it may be a little off topic and adult in nature to be considered appropriate. Its good to see that the same sex marriage which is now legal in the UK is having an affect across the pond.

    But heck, back to the real hot and steamy action, I would suggest you actually try it in action before being so adamant that its no good because unless you are prepared to explain why the laws of physics are in fact not correct your argument is falacious at best.

    David

  40. Richard56

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 14:46:56
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    The European unit is 1500 watts. The American unit is 1000 watts. Apparently the European unit was tweaked from their standard 2000 watt unit presumably because the 2000 watt unit tested too strong against bed bugs (the bed bugs blew away) per my understanding of David's prior posts. I would like to hear from anyone on this, but especially from David and the OP (distributor) , as to what the functional differences may be (American and European voltage differences aside) between the American and European units, and if the American unit was tested against bed bugs in the same way the European unit was. Also curious if anyone here has used the American unit.

    Richard

  41. Richard56

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 15:07:46
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    Related,

    (1)There is another unit sold in the USA called Eco Power. The picture on the Polti website and the specs are identical to the USA Cimex Eradicator base unit (without the steam disinfector) attachment. This is unlike in Europe where there is no identical base unit for the Cimex Eradicator. It therefore seems that the Eco Power unit combined with the steam disinfector would offer a better value for the identical unit for those wanting to use the unit for cleaning as well as disinfecting and bed bugs since the Eco Power comes with a full set of tools and the Cimex Eradicator doesn't come with any.

    (2) Any thoughts of how useful and efficient The Cimex Eradicator would be for dust mites on bedding, carpeting and drapes? From the videos it seems to offer a faster and more user-friendly experience then your typical steam machine which often requires towels, etc, for close work due to I presume lower temps and therefore a wetter output.

    Richard

  42. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 15:29:49
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    Hi Richard,

    Yes (2) is correct because of the higher temperatures the unit gets the target surfaces to the critical death temperature faster and as such its more efficient. You don't need to use a cloth to induce the heat build up because its already there.

    The output is not moist but will often produce a fine layer of droplets on a surface more through the heating of the cooler target surface and the use of the HPmed additive. In practice its not something that lasts for more than a few minutes and quickly dries.

    David

  43. Richard56

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 15:46:14
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    @David: The output is not moist but will often produce a fine layer of droplets on a surface more through the heating of the cooler target surface and the use of the HPmed additive. In practice its not something that lasts for more than a few minutes and quickly dries.
    --------
    On one hand you read that steam kills dust mites, on the other hand you read that moiture and humidity help breed dust mites. Given that this unit is dryer than others, do you think it's a good solution for household dust mites, or would one be better off investing the money in a good hepa vacuum, air filter, etc. ?

    Richard

  44. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 15:56:16
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    Hi Richard,

    I think its a good investment for an easier way to keep your home clean and fresh even before you look at things like dust mites. You are asking someone who uses it in his home if he thinks its a good idea, of course I will say yes.

    The reality is that not all contact dermatitis is the actual mite droppings and as such anything that helps reduce and remove allergens in your home without replying on harsh chemicals is a plus.

    David

  45. Richard56

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 16:09:29
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    Do you use it by itself or with the cleaning attachments from other similar Polti units? And if so, how? As you know, the CE doesn't come with the cleaning attachments, but I could still see it as a good adjunct to coventional cleaning even without attachments which sometimes I have found don't really work all that well anyway.

    Richard

  46. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 16:35:37
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    Hi,

    I don't often use it myself because one of my few perks in life is a good cleaner but as I am using it for the "super-heated" aspect as a sterilization tool it only works with the wand and the tools that fit into the end of that.

    Its used as a regular surface sterilizer on the grounds that it keeps things fresh for longer lasting if there is no background microbial activity.

    David

  47. Richard56

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 16:50:13
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    Ok. So you're exclusively using the superheated sterilization aspect of the device, rather than removing the superheated wand attachment and using the base unit with more coventiomal steam cleaning attachments like with conventional steam cleaning units. I think that could work for me as well if I can get by the sticker shock, as it's selling here for twice the price in Europe! Has your cleaner tried it to iron out fabrics or clothing, or would it be too hot for that?

    Richard

  48. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 4 years ago
    Thu Feb 5 2015 18:06:36
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    Hi,

    Yes it's usually us that is paying more so sorry if I lack sympathy and that's only because a lot of US companies evade tax on overseas operations.

    David


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