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More of Dr. Potter's resistance studies, via PCT

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  1. (deleted)

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 1:29:34
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    and the ever reliable Richard Kramer (must remember to check his column regularly).

    This time Dr. Kramer writes about the products and presentations at the NPMA's annual trade show in October.

    Two bedbug-related items:

    --Vapona (dichlorvos), a possible new tool for bedbugs, sometime in the future (we've been hearing of its off-label use and possible nastiness, see this.)

    and

    --brief summary results of recent effectiveness studies by Dr. Potter and colleagues (Suspend, Kicker, Phantom, Bedlam, Sterifab)

    The article is here:

    http://www.pctonline.com/articles/article.asp?MagID=1&ID=3077&IssueID=237

    Most interesting tidbit: "Bed bugs didn’t avoid treated harborages with feces whereas treated harborages without feces were avoided."

    Hmm.

    Oh, and Dr. Kramer does sound more optimistic in this one.

  2. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 6:48:45
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    Great catch, hopelessnomo. I blogged more here.

    "Bed bugs didn’t avoid treated harborages with feces whereas treated harborages without feces were avoided."

    Reason for PCOs to make sure harborages are found and cleaned out before treatment?

    I started and run the site but am "not an expert."
  3. itchyincharmcity

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 10:20:48
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    Hm. I took that to mean the oppsite, maybe you shouldn't clean them out. If they don't aavoid a harbaroage with feces, isn't that a godd thing? They walk into the poson and get killed?

  4. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 10:37:03
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    Itchy, you may well be right. I am probably reading it wrong. I was thinking if they avoided the harborages they'd be rooted out and wandering through more pesticides.

  5. (deleted)

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 12:11:57
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    Hi,

    I'm not sure that it's easy to parse the significance of that, but it does thicken the plot in many ways, particularly re the issue of whether PCOs should treat your whole home or not.

    So many questions.

    If feces is one more aggregation cue (like cockroaches, perhaps)...

    When Dr. Potter's colleague, Alvaro Romero, found that 2 out of 3 emerging nymphs avoided deltamethrin (although I'm not sure whether he was working with many times the normal application rate) it did seem like bad news. But does this now mean that they would not avoid treated surfaces if there were traces that signaled safety? (Never mind that if they're resistant... who cares! You're going to need mechanical methods either way.)

    I would not say it means that the harborage sites should not be cleaned. Any visible harborage sites that you can identify and control yourself, you should, right away. (And if you have a good PCO who inspects and actually wants to find the harborage sites before treatment, you are truly blessed.) Dr. Stephen Kells has this funny thing in his documents where he says that if you see bugs while inspecting you should "stop!" and initiate control methods right away. (Yeah, I think it's safe to say that seeing bedbugs probably would make you stop all on its own!) I really appreciate reading Kells and one of the things I learned from an interview of his is that bedbugs set up satellite harborage sites away from their typically close-to-the-bed sites.

    If PCOs don't treat your whole home, what does this mean for your chances of eradication, given that there might be susceptible bugs and perhaps also resistant bugs in the mix? And satellite sites? And where will the bugs go if they avoid treated surfaces?

    Always questions. It'll probably take years to get something like a complete picture.

  6. parakeets

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 12:31:30
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    Great post, hopelessnomo. I really appreciate the level of information I get from this blog and fourm. You guys are great.

  7. bummedindenver

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 13:40:24
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    I will second that sentiment, parakeets! I am so grateful for all the links to RELIABLE sources that I have gotten here. Thank you, thank you, once again, Nobugsonme, for this site. You have no doubt saved the lives and sanity of so many.

    Super information, hoplessnomo....

    For our 2nd and 3rd treatments, they ONLY used Suspend (treatment 1 was Suspend, gentrol, and CB-40). We found some improvement after treatment 1, but virtually no change after treatment 2, and then worsening bites in the days leading to treatment 3. Treatment 3 did nothing.

    That is when I ditched our PCO.

    Actually, I decided to ditch them after the OWNER of the company told me that our bed bug problem was, in fact, most likely a skin disorder after I called to tell her treatment 3 did not work. Oh, right, and my bites were inconsistent with bed bugs because some were on my face.....(apparently the ones on my neck, back, shoulders, and arms and all my husband's bites didn't count).

    But I digress...sorry.

  8. (deleted)

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 17:31:13
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    Parakeets, I've learned so much from you!

    Bummedindenver, I'm sorry about your bad experience. I know you told us that your PCO found evidence in the beginning. It is frustrating. I hope your DIY steam treatments start to show results. You may have to be very persistent and patient but I'm sure that you will succeed.

    And indeed, Nobugs for President as far as I'm concerned.

  9. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 19:48:29
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    If I were President, hopelessnomo would be the VP who was really the one who knew much more than me and always knew just what to do, and who should be the real President.

  10. (deleted)

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Thu Dec 20 2007 20:28:40
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    Nobugs, I know your game, you just want to avoid the campaign trail. No deal, my friend.

    I read the news too. And I definitely saw this: "[t]here are some incredibly beautiful hotels in this country [...] and if you are working on a political campaign, you will be staying in none of them."

    Embrace it. It's you, it's all you.

  11. currentinsomniac

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Fri Dec 21 2007 13:44:57
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    Our Tempo treatments with our PCO didn't work so before his 4th visit I suggested Phantom (which I had read about on Harvard's site being a good alternative for resistant strains). It does take longer to work (we got just as many bites as before for a few days) but the number of bites has dropped by half in the last week. It has been a week and a half and I'm getting only one or two new bites a night. So it does look promising...more so than other things we have used). Only thing is that it is quite toxic/carcinogenic and it's application areas are limited (which is bad news for the ones still alive and well in our car). Today our PCO will come again to use some bedlam in the cars and other places. Keep your fingers crossed for us!

  12. bugobsessed

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Fri Dec 21 2007 13:54:10
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    When I clicked on the link above for the article about Suspend, etc. I took me to a page on PCT Online, but there was nothing about Suspend on it. It also is asking me to log-in to search for more information.

    Does anyone have the article about Suspend. The numbers are disturbing to me because I think this is the only product the PCO is using. I would like to the info to my landlord because he said to me last night, "But I don't understand why it's not working. They spray is supposed to last for a long time." I figure if he can see the info coming from a professional organization, he'll be more apt to believe it than just accepting my word.

  13. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Fri Dec 21 2007 15:44:00
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    bugobsessed,
    I linked to my blog post about it above, and I think I quoted in full from all the relevant parts of the article (it was brief). So that might help.

  14. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Fri Dec 21 2007 15:44:36
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    Maybe PCTOnline was down. hopelessnomo's link works fine now:
    http://www.pctonline.com/articles/article.asp?MagID=1&ID=3077&IssueID=237

  15. bugobsessed

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    Posted 10 years ago
    Fri Dec 21 2007 20:30:26
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    Thank you! I looked at your link again, Nobugs. Now I see that the info you quoted was actually toward the bottom. I was distracted by the upper treatments in bold and didn't read the whole page carefully-- web ADD I suppose!


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