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Is this worth it: Thermal Using Connor's Pest in Virginia
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ScaredOfHowBadItCouldGet
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Thu Jul 16 2009 20:13:52
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We are new to bed bugs, and we don't have it bad yet. I want to make sure we keep it that way. We have just found out we have bed bugs, though according to the PCO who came out it is a "very mild" case. He has said that he will treat the master bedroom for $250, and thinks that will take care of the problem. I don't really trust him, though, because he told us that since it is so mild, we probably don't even need to worry about bagging clothes, or treating anything that wasn't immediately around the bed.
To complicate matters for us, we are moving in just a couple of weeks, and we REALLY don't want to take bed bugs with us. I contacted Connor's Pest Control in Northern Virginia. They said that for $1500, they will come out and thermal treat the townhouse. Then, they will have their k9 come the next day and make sure all the bugs are gone.
Is it worth paying them the $1500? Am I going overboard over what seems to be only a mild problem so far? Also, since we live in a town home with units on either side, will this work, or will they just run away during the treatment? The guy at Connor's said that in their experience, it almost always works, even in multi-unit dwellings, so long as the other units aren't already infected. I don't think the other units are infected, because they are both empty right now, and there's really no reason for the bugs to go over there.
Also, I am pretty sure that we have bed bugs that have spread to the car--particularly in the trunk. I know hot days can help with that, but I don't think it gets hot enough in the trunk to kill the bed bugs. Any advice on how to deal with that. I've heard we can have the car vikaned. Has anyone done this? What does it cost?
After reading some of the horror stories on here, I am willing to do just about anything to make sure it doesn't get this bad for us. We have to make a decision very soon, so any advice would be appreciated--both on thermal generally, and on Connor's, if you have used them.
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your host
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Posted 3 years ago
Thu Jul 16 2009 22:24:15
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Some comments on Connor's here. (I think.)
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buggyinsocal
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Posted 3 years ago
Fri Jul 17 2009 9:43:37
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I cannot speak about Connor's since I live clear across the country.
However, I can tell you that I had my apartment treated with thermal, and I live in one unit in a four plex. If your thermal providers know their stuff, they know how and have the equipment to raise the temps at a rate that keeps the bugs from fleeing. None of my neighbors had bed bugs before the treatment, and none of them had them after.
As for whether it's worth the money to do thermal instead of chemical--that's a decision that only you can make, and one you can only make after you've looked up the other threads on that provider.
If you think that Connor's knows their stuff, add up how much it would cost to treat the townhouse now with chemicals and to do all the prep for that. Then add up how much it might cost to have to also treat the place you're moving into if the chemical treatment doesn't take care of the problem in the time frame before the move because it might work in that time, but it might not. Now add in how much it's worth it to you not to have to act as bait to the bugs while the chemical treatment works.
If that total amount is a lot less than thermal, then maybe chemical is a good option.
If the total amount is the same or close, then the $1500 is probably worth it.
(I know nothing about Connor's, and I'm away from my usual networks. Since I'm relying on rogue unlocked wifi networks, I don't want to risk losing the connection just to go read those other posts Nobugs has already linked to. Just so you know.)
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ScaredOfHowBadItCouldGet
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Fri Jul 17 2009 11:20:42
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Thanks nobugs and buggy. It looks like others have had good experiences with Connor's, though I'm not sure any of them did the thermal. But Connor's is the only place anywhere near Virginia that does thermal, so they're my only choice. I hope that also means they have a lot of experience.
Buggy, I'm glad to hear that thermal worked for you, even in a fourplex. We have units on either side, but they have both been empty since before the problem started (or at least since before we became aware of the problem). I hope that means we are the only ones infested, and that this will work. I'm crossing my fingers. $1500 is absolutely worth it to me if it means I definitely won't have to deal with this again. I know that thermal isn't 100%, but I'm hoping its close.
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buggyinsocal
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Posted 3 years ago
Fri Jul 17 2009 12:02:34
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If done properly, it should be 100%. I'd had an infestation for several months, and one thermal treatment got them all in one go.
Ask lots and lots of questions of the PCOs prior to treatment. Make darned sure all electronic devices, esp. those with hard drives (like DVRs) are unplugged--not off, but unplugged--before treatment.
And if at all possible, see if you can't get those neighboring units inspected by the PCO. Depending on how long they've been unoccupied, it is possible that your bed bug problem came from the bugs in a neighboring unit migrating into your unit after the people who lived next door left. I don't say that to alarm you; but it would really, really suck to spend all that money on treatment only to find that your bugs come right back from next door. If the arrival of the bugs coincides with the emptiness of the places next to you, I'd be more concerned. (I should also add that all three other units in my four plex were inspected prior to my thermal treatment for exactly that reason.)
You can also look for posts that use the tag thermal for more detailed accounts of peoples' experiences with thermal.
Most failures with thermal are a result of one of three things: an inexperienced provider who is still learning how to use thermal effectively. Good PCOs will tell you that thermal is as much art as science, and failures do occur early on in the learning curve; reinfestation from a source like a neighboring unit and/or bringing them back from someplace like work; the person in question never had bed bugs to start out with, in which case bites continue because they aren't bed bug bites.
I have heard at least one story of someone who had "thermal" treatment done, but I don't think it was a reputable firm. It felt more like someone taking advantage of the person seeking treatment because as described the protocols didn't sound like what a full thermal treatment requires, but it wasn't on your coast that that happened. Connor's sounds like an established company who's done thermal before.
Oh, and if you get a chance, once your problem is resolved, no matter what technique you use to resolve it, please consider coming back and posting in the success stories forum to let others know how your problem turned out. A lot of newbies look forward to reading those stories to give them hope that it will be over some day, and the more stories we have, the better a sense we all get of what works and what doesn't.
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ScaredOfHowBadItCouldGet
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Fri Jul 17 2009 12:09:30
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I don't think the bugs came from the empty units. We temporarily stayed in a sublet for a few weeks while I was on the road taking a class. At the end of our stay there, we discovered bed bugs in the sublet, and I think they came back with us to our permanent home. It is possible that the bugs showed up at our permanent place first, shortly before we moved, and that I actually brought them to the sublet. I'm not certain.
Connor's said that they would have their K9 inspect the adjoining units after the treatment, to be sure they aren't there. But should I insist that they also do a pre-treatment inspection?
Thanks.
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buggyinsocal
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Posted 3 years ago
Fri Jul 17 2009 13:33:59
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I think as long as they're inspecting neighboring units at some point, you should be fine.
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ScaredOfHowBadItCouldGet
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Fri Jul 17 2009 16:48:43
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I talked to Connor's about doing vikane in our car. They said they can do it, but it will be $750. He says that they charge for use of the chamber, so its the same price no matter what they are are vikaning. Does that seem like a good price? Or so people know other places in the vicinity of DC that would do it for less.
So far, I have been impressed with Connor's, because they really seem to know what they are doing and what they are talking about. But if someone else can recommend a good person to treat the car for less, I would like to hear it.
Thanks for all the advice.
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LeesburgBedBugGuy
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Sun Sep 20 2009 6:15:11
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I had the Thermal Treatment done by Connors in mid june of 09. At first they said everything could stay in the apartment, then they told us the couch, computer, and TV had to be moved to their so called "Fumigation" lab, which is just a Shipping container behind their office where your stuff gets thrown in with other stuff with all sorts of bugs. So we took the couch out there, and they came to do the heat treatment. They said it would be a max of 4 hours, it actually took 6. Before they came, they did a preliminary check of all the surrounding units and found nothing, they did just a visual check of our apartment and found alot. During the course of the heat treatment they claimed that they could not get the heat to rise to the correct temp, so they jerry rigged some things hoping to make it the right temp, seeing as how I was paying $1250 for this treatment I was not too happy about the "jerry rigging" part. So finally the treatment was completed, and they told us "We will be back within a week, and then after 30 days we will come back again.
So they came back after the 1 week, brought lady-bug the bed bug dog, she searched and found nothing. But they never came back for their 30 day check-up, and I have tried to call, but never reach anybody. It is now September, and the bed bugs are returning.
If connors tells you that they will put stuff in your walls to prevent them from running, and hiding in the walls MAKE SURE THEY DO IT.
As of right now, because I am not paying them again, when they didnt even stick to their end of the bargain, I am using a very simple method to kill of bedbugs. Get your self a spray bottle, fill it with 70-100% alcohol, and spray your mattress, and floors with it, this will kill any live bedbugs, and damage the eggs as well. I have killed off all of the bed bugs in one room, and after doing many checks, have not found any more in that room. In my opinion, look around, there are companies that would love to do it for cheaper, just to be able to say they successfully treated a bed bug case.
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your host
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Posted 3 years ago
Sun Sep 20 2009 18:07:50
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Leesburg Bed Bug Guy,
I would strongly urge anyone who has a complaint against a company to contact them and complain. Is it really true that you called repeatedly during business hours and no one ever answered the phone? If so, then you need to follow up via other means. I note that their website claims 100% guarantee.
You said that you have bed bugs 3 months later. While it is entirely possible the company you hired did not get the job done, it's also fully possible for a thermal treatment to work and for there to be continued exposure to bed bugs -- either from neighbors in your apartment building, or from other sources (workplace, school, movie theater, etc.)
What I would not do is try and control bed bugs using 91% alcohol. While it works as a contact killer, you are unlikely to be able to spray each individual bed bug directly (which is what would be required).
I hope you're able to get good help and get rid of this problem. It may require the whole building to be carefully inspected as it does not sound like this has happened yet.
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Kill bed bugs
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Sun Sep 20 2009 21:30:09
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I am concerned. Something does not seem right. Heat treat companies are making available special car trailers for heat treating cars. Some companies will do heat treat in the clients garage or a specialy prepared garage that they have. Heat is far superior to Vikane. Dwelling Heat Treatment pricing is dependent upon the size of the unit being treated. Moving potentially infected iitems to an outside heat treat process makes no sence unless the items are going directly to a new dwelling
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spideyjg
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Posted 3 years ago
Sun Sep 20 2009 22:21:51
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Kill bed bugs - 48 minutes ago »
I am concerned. Something does not seem right. Heat treat companies are making available special car trailers for heat treating cars. Some companies will do heat treat in the clients garage or a specialy prepared garage that they have. Heat is far superior to Vikane.Who is doing that? First I have heard of it.
Why is thermal "far" superior to Vikane? Either done properly is a nuke and pave 100% cure but either can fail if mistakes are made.
Thermal is too risky on musical instruments where Vikane is harmless to them.
Jim
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your host
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 0:05:44
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Kill bed bugs - 2 hours ago »
I am concerned. Something does not seem right. Heat treat companies are making available special car trailers for heat treating cars. Some companies will do heat treat in the clients garage or a specialy prepared garage that they have. Heat is far superior to Vikane. Dwelling Heat Treatment pricing is dependent upon the size of the unit being treated. Moving potentially infected iitems to an outside heat treat process makes no sence unless the items are going directly to a new dwellingHuh?
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Kill bed bugs
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 17:12:03
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I was just at a reasort that has plush cabins. The General Manager indicated that they used Vikane in one of their cabins. Three weeks latter the infestation was back and no one had been in the cabin since the introduction of Vikane. This is not the first time that I have herd of this. Vikane is a poison. Heat is benign and it works; research clearly shows this. Preperation is realitively easy. and heat it is cost effective. This is a GREEN scoiety that we live in. It is better for the client and better fot the environment. I'll take the heat over Vilkane anyday and everyday.
Pest control operators that doen't use it or recommend it for bed bug erradication to their customers are, clearly living in the dark ages. and providing a disservice.
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buggyinsocal
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 18:23:20
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It is true that Vikane gas has negative environmental consequences.
But so does thermal.
After all, the amount of propane (or other fuel sources) used to take a structure's temp up to those levels is significant.
The failure of Vikane in treating one cabin is not an indictment of the treatment type overall. The expertise of individual PCOs and pest control companies varies dramatically.
Vikane can be a very effective treatment. So can thermal. So can conventional chemical treatment when done properly.
Regardless of my own personal preferences, which are pretty much public knowledge, my own personal fight with bed bugs and the many months after that that I've followed the boards have firmly convinced me that what we need in the war against bed bugs is a variety of options since not every bed bug sufferer will prefer or even benefit from the same method of treatment. Much as I personally prefer one shot (if done properly) treatments like heat and Vikane, most landlords won't foot the bill. I will not condemn bed bug sufferers without the economic resources to fight bugs to being stuck with limited options by inflicting my personal preference for treatments that use fewer chemical pesticides on people who have no choice in the matter.
The fact that some bed bug populations show resistance to some chemicals, to me, seems a good argument for wider availability of thermal and Vikane. At the same time, however, it also suggests that we need to put resources into developing chemical pesticides that are safe and effective against bed bugs. Bed bugs are a particularly difficult to treat pest, so there is no magic bullet named Chemical X, named Thermal, or named Vikane.
Maligning PCOs who don't offer thermal doesn't do anything to make thermal more widely available to people in metro areas without providers.
And I can see plenty of scenarios where thermal isn't the best option: someone who lives with a number of rare books or musical instruments, someone whose livelihood is home based and requires materials that can't be heat treated, someone who lives next door to a tenant or owner who will not treat and refuses to allow PCOs in for even an inspection.
Anyone reading this post should keep those general principles in mind.
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spideyjg
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 22:07:03
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buggyinsocal - 3 hours ago » Bed bugs are a particularly difficult to treat pest, so there is no magic bullet named Chemical X, named Thermal, or named Vikane.
Maligning PCOs who don't offer thermal doesn't do anything to make thermal more widely available to people in metro areas without providers.
And I can see plenty of scenarios where thermal isn't the best option: someone who lives with a number of rare books or musical instruments, someone whose livelihood is home based and requires materials that can't be heat treated, someone who lives next door to a tenant or owner who will not treat and refuses to allow PCOs in for even an inspection.
Anyone reading this post should keep those general principles in mind.That and everything else buggy said.
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Kill bed bugs
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 23:08:44
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I could not disagree with you more. It is individuals lke yourself that continue to perpetuate the chemical myths that three, four or maybe five selctively made chemical cocktails will solve the suffer of bed bugs problem. And that is a shame. Beecause nothing is further from being accurate. You apparently think that one chemical regime is more suited then another kind for a particular individual. And how you draw those conclusions totlally escapes me. Because the solution to the problem dosen't rely so much on what you have identified as, much as it depends more upon what you are not able to identify. And that is because the typical Pest Control Operator is only able to identify 30% of a bed bug problem. And that is not according to me. Rick Cooper has made that statment in a number of his articles.
Your point about Thermal Heat being bad for the environment dosen't hold water. Millions of tow motors operate on propane inside buildings daily.
Heat Treat propane fuel systems are always...contained outside.
But what about Thermal Heat using electricity. I suppose that is not good for the environment too.
I don't think so.
Your point about rare books and miusical insturments: come on! Is that the best you can do?
Do you really think that a person who knows that the Thermal Heat is finallly going to solve their nightmare with bed bugs is going to resist getting HEAT TREATMENT because they don't want to move some rare boks or musical insturment from their premises? Yous have just insulted the intelligence of thousands of readetrs of this site.
Cost: In many cases the cost of Thermal Heat Treatment or Remediation can cost comparably to mutliple chemical treatments.
Not to mention , that Heat Treatment will solve their bed bug problem.
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spideyjg
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 23:24:26
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So what thermal company do you work for?
I don't make a dime on anything pest related so I have no bias.
I do have some valuable, irreplaceable instruments and typical glues used in instrument construction, hide glues, will lose their adhesion in temps over 120 and sudden temp changes wreck havoc with instruments. Ask a luthier if you don't believe me. Vikane is the safer option FOR THE INSTRUMENTS SURVIVAL!
I did use everything under the sun including heat in solving my problem.
I have absolutely nothing against thermal treatment but it isn't the only thing I would use. My whole apartment is surrounded in he voids by DE and sealed with caulk. I use minimal pesticides when insects pop up which any more is almost never.
Jim
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your host
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Posted 3 years ago
Mon Sep 21 2009 23:27:25
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Kill bed bugs - 12 minutes ago »
I could not disagree with you more. It is individuals lke yourself that continue to perpetuate the chemical myths that three, four or maybe five selctively made chemical cocktails will solve the suffer of bed bugs problem.Kill bed bugs,
1) You are barking up the wrong tree. As she said, buggyinsocal HAD a thermal treatment and from many of her posts we can gather she is perfectly happy with the results.
2) Different solutions suit different situations.
Many of us have living situations where a landlord pays for treatment. Try convincing a landlord to take the option which is pricier (at least in the short run). And consider also if it's the best option if you just got bed bugs from your neighbor, who may or may not have reported bed bugs but is nonetheless sending a steady supply.
I am no great fan of pesticide spray treatments, and many of us would prefer thermal treatments in a heartbeat, but they're not always the best solution for everyone, not always affordable, and not always available.
Many folks also want container treatment of some stuff en route to a move, and few thermal providers seem to be offering this yet (which is a shame). Plenty of Vikane options abound for that.
I have two additional concerns:
a) When people come on the forums with a strong agenda, as you seem to have, they often have a stake in the industry. Do you have some connection with the thermal treatment industry?
If you're simply a happy consumer of thermal, that's fine, but you must see that the option is not open to anyone.
b) Your posts are seriously off-topic in this thread, because the original poster was asking whether it was worth getting a thermal treatment done by a PARTICULAR firm in Virginia, and others were giving feedback on this query.
That said, it is probably best to curtail this discussion, at least in this thread.
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Kill bed bugs
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Tue Sep 22 2009 10:17:11
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The problem is that chemical treatments have not provided the solution to the erradication of bed bugs safely and effectively. This forum demonstrates that. People have recieved three, four and some times up to seven chemical treatments with out solving the problem. Certainly the occupant has some resposability in preperation, sealing cracks etc. DE can't be put everywhere, so it is not comprehnsive. A lisenced PCO can't continue to sell a service that just dosen't work. You said Thermal Heat is not always available. Then the people seeking solutions to their bed bug problem need to demand it. The market shortly down the road will require it
It is a global community. And much of the bed bug nightmare that the United States
now suffers from is a result of it. However, I hold the PCO industry resposible for not recongnizing the need to change and adapt.The Pest Control Industry is very threatened by the potential providers of Thermal Heat.
They have thought that they were imune thinking, only they can solve pest problems.
That is not the case anymore.
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your host
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Posted 3 years ago
Tue Sep 22 2009 13:16:01
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Kill bed bugs,
Since you have shown yourself not to be a careful reader of this thread, I am not going to reiterate that this thread could not be much more pro-thermal if it tried. I also will not bother repeating my polite request that you stop hijacking this thread.
But I will repeat the question which spideyjg and I have asked, are you in the thermal industry?
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Kill bed bugs
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Tue Sep 22 2009 16:31:15
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No bug, my responces were made to enlighten Spidi. I saw your favorable position to Thermnal Heat. Curious as to why you ask if I am in the Thermal Heat bussiness? I don/t think I have violated any of the rules and requirents of the web site prohibiting self promotion even, if I were in the bussiness. However, since you are both dying to know let me put your curiosity to rest. I own
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buggyinsocal
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Posted 3 years ago
Tue Sep 22 2009 17:29:24
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As a long time veteran of the internet, I would like to point out to any reasonable people reading this thread that it is generally wise policy not to engage with trolls, as feeding the energy creatures only gives them what they seek.
However, I do think it's important to clear up any factual inaccuracies that comments in this thread that I won't reply directly to might contain.
Thermal, like any human activity, has an impact on the environment. Electric cars themselves may create less polluting chemicals from their tailpipes, but they still have a long term cost since the electricity used to recharge them often comes from coal-burning power plants. In the same way, there is likely some carbon load from all forms of thermal treatment--whether powered by electric or propane or some other fuel source.
On the other hand, Vikane has conclusively been shown to cause environmental degradation, something I pointed out months ago when I liked to an article that said exactly that. This isn't the same article, but it contains much of the same information:
http://www.tgdaily.com/content/view/41702/178/
While I don't myself own rare books, one of my profs in grad school did--as he was a scholar of a much earlier literary period than I am and his wife worked at a rare book store. I can imagine that for them the idea of damaging the collection I presume they personally had would be incentive enough to risk the additional environmental harm of Vikane treatment, should they ever encounter bed bugs, over thermal.
Personally, I prefer to keep my exposure to chemical pesticides as low as possible. As anyone who regularly and carefully reads my posts knows, I'm a huge fan of thermal and have openly and vociferously offered that I would choose it as my preferred method should I have the misfortune to encounter bed bugs again.
I will gladly discuss the reasons for that with any individual who acts like a grown up online. However, I am disinclined to attempt communication with people who appear to be averse to civil discourse that ends in complete sentences.
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spideyjg
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Posted 3 years ago
Tue Sep 22 2009 20:13:52
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KBB,
You still haven't answered the question of who is providing chamber thermal treatments. If your company is by all means give up some details in another thread as to how and what prep needs to be done. Pimping your service left and right and poopooing all other treatments will get you the stink eye. Admitting you provide a service is a different story.
Chamber thermal is a beautiful idea and hopefully will spread but to the best of our collective knowledge no body does it.
Back in the day and if you really need to see it I can point you to where I suggested the thermal guys were leaving a gaping hole by not offering a chamber thermal treatment for people moving.
Some Vikane providers do this and if somebody is offering a nuke and pave thermal for folks to move bug free I would encourage folks to use it.
If both are available to a BB victim they decide for themselves. Some areas neither one or just one is available to them.
During my infestation thermal wasn't an option in San Diego but chambered Vikane was so we took advantage of that along with the pesticide treatment.
Jim
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Kill bed bugs
newbite
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Posted 3 years ago
Tue Sep 22 2009 21:24:22
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Sorry I got called out to an emergency. It has been one right after another. Just got back to the station.
Jim, I thought you would draw some hasty conclusions "Pimping my service left and right" No you are wrong! What I was about to say before I got called out was, that I own no Thermal Heat equipment nor, do I build such equipment or own any part of a Thermal Heat Treat bussiness.
I have investigated the process throughly thinking that I might get into the bussiness.
There are companies in the midwest that are currently doing Heat Treat of BB infrested cars
in the owners garage. One company told me that they are making a 36 Ft car trailer to do chamber thermal treatments for cars and other items.
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