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diatomaceous earth - no dead bugs/no site of bugs?

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  1. PB1109

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Fri Aug 4 2017 9:39:50
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    We're dealing with a bug problem in our house - not in our bedrooms or beds, so we're awaiting an official ID of specimans from LouBugs to confirm our suspicion from photos and bug behavior that they're bat or bird bugs - but I'm curious: I applied diatomaceous earth all around our beds to prevent any bugs from joining us in our sleep (so far they haven't), and I also sprinkled it all over the areas where we've seen the bugs (mostly in our bathroom walls and on our basement ceiling). And voila....no more bugs.

    My concern is that I'm not seeing them dead anywhere...we'd spotted at least 75 bugs in the areas mentioned above, and understand that means there are likely many more hiding elsewhere, but wouldn't we see their dead bodies around? Have I simply scared them futher into our walls and they'll creep back out when we vaccuum it all up? Or, would this be more typical bat and bird bug behavior where they're like "no bats or birds to eat off of here, and yikes, this stuff hurts" and they've just....taken off for elsewhere?

    Would love any insights. While we're waiting on the *official* ID - all we've got so far is "not typical of a common bed bug" from Lou's check of my photos and one dried up speciman <more on the way>, a declaration of bedbugs from another entomologist, and our PCO says he doesn't believe we're dealing with bed bugs given the behavior - we've got a chimney sweep coming to seal up any spots, then we'll spray, if needed, but it seems the DE has done the trick.

    Am I being duped by the bugs?? Where are they, dead or alive??

  2. PB1109

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 11:21:00
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    *bump* - hoping anyone with DE/bug experience has some insight to offer as to where the dang bugs have gone.

  3. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 11:51:05
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    Hi,

    Its its bed bugs and the correct DE it will work.

    If its bat or bird DE applied int he directions / instructions for bed bugs will not work.

    Please stop and only proceed with treatment when you have a species ID.

    David Cain
    Bed Bugs Limited

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  4. PB1109

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 12:23:40
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    Thank you! Yes, we haven't done anything past the DE since we had the conflicting ID reports. Waiting (im)patiently until the official ID next week, and until then for our paranoias sake, just curious of the odds that the DE either worked or didn't (could it really be that easy?!).

    I suppose it's an impossible question at the moment and we should at least rest easy that we aren't currently seeing bugs anymore.

    bed-bugscouk - 29 minutes ago  » 
    Hi,
    Its its bed bugs and the correct DE it will work.
    If its bat or bird DE applied int he directions / instructions for bed bugs will not work.
    Please stop and only proceed with treatment when you have a species ID.
    David Cain
    Bed Bugs Limited

  5. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 12:35:10
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    Hi,

    DE and bed bugs can be easy, the easiest option is TbyPMR with DE.

    Bat bugs can be dealt with using only DE but its a much more complex situation because the pattern of treatment is dictated by the facts of the infestation and with all due respect the skills are not that easy to transfer, its a job for someone with experience of bat bugs or bird bugs as access to primary next sites may be needed.

    Its a step by step thing and yes celebrate not seeing anything as a very good sign and try not to focus about if's and what's until you actually know the facts.

    To that end seek relaxation and avoid reading other cases and too much ahead of yourself as its a little like watching a drama or soap opera when you are in a bad mood. Its unlikely to help and eventually it becomes a cyclical emotional rollar coaster in itself that you body grows accustomed to needing.

    I know its hard to wait but its a virtue that is work working on.

    David

  6. PB1109

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 12:48:34
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    My husband just applauded your advice, so I'll take heed and <try to> relax I know we've got the best with LouBugs working on ID. Just one more question before I try to go enjoy my weekend around all of this:

    Our PCO, who doesn't believe we're dealing with bedbugs based on their behavior, suggested they may just go away on their own if the host is gone (we believe the chirping in our walls we heard was the bats or birds fleeing their roosts/nests, which was the same time we started seeing the bugs come from the walls <chimney sweep coming Tuesday to clean and close up any gaps>). Does that ever happen? If they were bat or bird bugs they'd just go away without their host (perhaps the DE helped scoot them along more quickly?).

    Thanks much for your advice and insight.

    bed-bugscouk - 8 minutes ago  » 
    Hi,
    DE and bed bugs can be easy, the easiest option is TbyPMR with DE.
    Bat bugs can be dealt with using only DE but its a much more complex situation because the pattern of treatment is dictated by the facts of the infestation and with all due respect the skills are not that easy to transfer, its a job for someone with experience of bat bugs or bird bugs as access to primary next sites may be needed.
    Its a step by step thing and yes celebrate not seeing anything as a very good sign and try not to focus about if's and what's until you actually know the facts.
    To that end seek relaxation and avoid reading other cases and too much ahead of yourself as its a little like watching a drama or soap opera when you are in a bad mood. Its unlikely to help and eventually it becomes a cyclical emotional rollar coaster in itself that you body grows accustomed to needing.
    I know its hard to wait but its a virtue that is work working on.
    David

  7. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 13:03:14
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    Hi,

    Bat and bird bugs only come into homes because their original food source is gone. They return to that site between increases in the hope the original will return or at least a new primary host. In the case of magratory birds such as martins and swallows this can give the impression of an annual pattern of arrival and breaks inactivity due to primary hosts occupation.

    Sounds like it's all too complex for your PCO to figure out and that they are more at home at http://www.ostrichbug.com than http://www.batbugs.com (sadly both sites are real).

    David

  8. PB1109

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Sat Aug 5 2017 13:10:22
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    Aha. Well, with that I'll sign off until we hear back from LouBugs Many thanks for the advice and encouragement to find some peace of mind while we wait!

  9. PB1109

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Fri Aug 11 2017 10:11:47
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    Hi David,

    Wondering if I can get some treatment insight from you: LouBugs has at least confirmed that what we have are not common bed bugs. He's tested them on his own blood and they aren't biting (which explains why they aren't in our beds biting us). He's uncertain of an official ID, however, and would like more samples, which I'm happy to send as I find, but after three weeks from having first noticed these guys in our house, we're really ready for a treatment plan.

    I'd love your expertise.

    Some background: on the first night when we found these guys scattered across our master bathroom wall, we sprayed a commercial spray (my husbands family owns hotels and has this stuff) along the wall in there. To note: we're in a row home, and the walls where we've found the bugs are made of stone, much of it exposed throughout the house, and every floor has a bricked up fireplace (4 floors). Given that the day we found the bugs were followed by two days of loud chirping in the main floor fireplace, our assumption has been that there lies the culprit. Whatever was in the wall seems to have flown away, but these little buggers remain. Our chimney sweep will be sealing our unused chimneys next week to prevent future settlers.

    The bugs have been found randomly scattered throughout the house since that night, one on an exterior wall in our bedroom, a few in the bathroom directly below the master where we first found them, one or two in the main living area, and then ALL over our <furnished> basement ceiling. All during the day, at the top of walls close to or on the ceilings, generally close to the exposed stone walls. About 75 total, mostly little clear babies; possibly about 20 unfed adults <smaller than an appleseed>.

    I sprinkled DE all over and it seems to have done the trick, we've only found about 4 babies in the basement in over a week. *We've found NO dead bugs, which alarms me.

    After Lou's confirmation that they aren't common ed bugs, I rinsed the DE off the stone wall in the shower and out popped a few unfed adults. My assumption now having found no dead bugs is that they're all hiding.

    I wonder if you have suggestions for treatment given that we don't have an official ID. We're inclined this weekend to suck up the current layers of DE (I believe I sprinkled too much in many places), spray all the crevices around the exposed stone walls, and then lightly dust the DE on them, as well as along our baseboards <though, all the bugs have been found on our ceiling, which is drywall, so I can't figure out how they get there>. Our PCO, as I mentioned before, believes they'll just go away without their host. Our original PCO before him ID'd the bugs as bedbugs and didn't even come out to look at our house. Which is why we've taken this whole thing into our own hands.

    What would you do in this situation?

    Many many thanks for any insight you can offer.

  10. loubugs

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Fri Aug 11 2017 12:35:05
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    PB1109 - 5 days ago  » 
    Aha. Well, with that I'll sign off until we hear back from LouBugs Many thanks for the advice and encouragement to find some peace of mind while we wait!

    Definitely not Cimex lectularius but that was obvious from behavior and pictures. Specimens confirm. I have 3 adult females now and no males plus various nymph stages. 2 are alive but they don't like feeding on me at all. That's depressing but I'll try again. They seem prone to dessication, more so than common bed bugs as not many live ones ever made it to me alive. It's not one of the normal bat bugs whose pictures have popped up on this site before.
    Sorry, didn't take any pictures yet.
    Treatment would have to be aimed at its normal host area. They are crawling around because the normal host is no longer around or there are few numbers, but there are high numbers of bugs with less natural hosts upon which to feed.

    Professional entomologist/arachnologist. I consult on all matters dealing with insects and arachnids, including those of natural history and biology to pest management and forensic entomology investigations.
  11. bugs_bug_me

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Mon Aug 14 2017 5:42:50
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    oh wow, so bed bat and bird would be that easily miss diagnosed? i recently spent weekend at friends , she has an attic space and a modified fireplace not sure if it is sealed off but it is decoration now not used. my belongings sat next to t piled up, as i had not had any issues with unidentified bites on my daughter or i for a few years and had never seen and or their poo in our home since we moved into it 5 years ago, i took sleeping pillow with me also having looked it over and again seeing nothing when changed its case(clean 1 had been bagged or months)and blankets for her and i to use there, she used all the blankets wed had with us but the pillow stayed with my backpack and over night things, as us adults were working on house projects we did not sleep at all, around 6 i carried my things to the porch where found a few what appeared to be bed bugs(have had issue prior to moving here) on the outside of bag and pillow case, i killed them in haste thinking were bed bugs, left my things outside for the day in heavy heat and over night the next morning around 5 i took out socks that had been on floor near our things and found 1 and another near the pillow. is it possible she has bat or bird and neither of us has bed? do they look that alike? her exterminator is coming today for other reasons what do i tell her, now? would that many live in my things that id never noticed or were they trying go home with me , would they live in the fluff of a pillow and not see stains anywhere on pillows ? they werent in the hems as far as i could see especially as big as 1 was it would have been very seen....oh so dont know how to tell her 1 of us has a problem and hers could be 3 different things if they are that alike....advice anyone

  12. Nobugsonme

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    Posted 2 months ago
    Mon Aug 14 2017 8:15:30
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    bugs_bug_me,

    Please start a new thread and repost the message above. These are good questions and you will get more views/responses that way. It's not a good idea to "hijack" an existing thread because it doesn't help you or the original poster above. Posting your own thread with your questions is a win-win.

    I started and run the site but am "not an expert."

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