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David Cain: Passive Monitor - Placed It Wrong on Bed

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  1. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Mon Feb 13 2017 8:10:08
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    Hi David,
    I placed the passive monitor in the incorrect place on my aunt's bed. It is a single bed with a mattress, box spring, and a wooden frame. I thought she slept with her head at the foot board so I put the monitor on the box spring on the side against the wall near the foot board. However, I just realized that she actually sleeps in it with her head at the headboard. The left side of the bed is facing a wall and the headboard is facing back into the room with a lot of stuff stored behind it. Do I need two monitors for this bed - one on the box spring on the side against the wall toward the headboard and one in the middle top of the box spring toward the headboard? Or, if not, how do I place this monitor? Should I get pictures after she wakes up?
    Thanks. I feel real stupid making this mistake and must have done it because I was so stressed. I don't know why it took me over two weeks to figure the mistake out.

  2. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Mon Feb 13 2017 8:35:35
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    Hi,

    There is an old trades quote:

    Measure twice - cut once

    The Passive Monitor should be placed at the head end. In a situation where the head end faces into the room the correct install is just around the corner at the head end along the "dark edge". You should be able to move it.

    Hope that helps.

    David Cain
    Bed Bugs Limited

    If you have found this information helpful please consider leaving feedback on social media via google+ or FaceBook or by like/loving the images.

    In accordance with the AUP and FTC (legal requirements) I openly disclose my vested interest in Passive Monitors as the inventor and patent holder. Since 2009 they have become an integral part in how we resolve bed bug infestations. I also have a professional relationship with PackTite in that they distribute my product under their own branding. I do not however receive any financial remuneration for any comments I make about products.
  3. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Mon Feb 13 2017 18:03:23
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    David,
    How close to the head end on the side facing the wall of the bed should the monitor be placed. What is the "dark edge"? Not sure if I put it close enough to the head on the bed on the side facing the wall. I guess the 2 week count begins again.

  4. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Mon Feb 13 2017 18:12:23
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    Dark edge = the edge / side that is darkest because it faces the wall.

    Light edge being the sides which are open to the room and thus lighter.

    I am somewhat confused as to how I could have been clearer with my previous instructions with regards this placement. I think it may be a symptom of the fact that you are "bouncing around" and not actually focusing on the task at hand.

    David

  5. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Thu Feb 16 2017 23:14:38
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    Hi David,
    I put the monitor in the new location 3 days ago. After holding it down a while it stuck. The following is the new location on the box spring near the headboard: https://www.flickr.com/photos/151342794@N02/ It is on the side of the box spring that is against the wall. Is it ok?

    Thanks.

  6. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 15:46:53
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    Hi, David, is this placement correct? Bed is facing into the room with one side against the well. The monitor is one the side against the wall toward the head: https://www.flickr.com/photos/151342794@N02/

  7. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 17:15:11
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    Hi,

    This should be clear:

    single box base bed length against wall by David Cain, on Flickr

    David

  8. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 17:39:29
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    David,
    Now more confused. Before you said " In a situation where the head end faces into the room the correct install is just around the corner at the head end along the "dark edge"." The picture you just posted today looks like it is on the head end, not on the dark side facing the wall toward the head end. Please clarify.
    Thanks.

  9. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 18:00:45
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    Hi,

    The arrow points to the dark area between the long edge and the wall. Ideally you would have provided a shot with the bed away from the wall if you were at all confused with the instructions.

    David

  10. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 18:09:42
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    David,
    The picture I provided was of the dark side facing the wall - I moved the bed away from the wall so I could give you that picture. Thanks for your last post - I now see I evidently have to move it closer to the head end on the side facing the wall. From the arrow on your picture above, it looked to me like it had to be placed on the head end of the bed toward the side facing the wall, rather than on the side facing the wall toward the head end. I will take a picture after I change the placement so you can confirm my placement.
    Thanks.

  11. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 18:36:43
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    Hi,

    My head may well explode if you ask me to look at it one more time.

    David

  12. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 19:23:32
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    Don't want your head to explode, but want to get it correct. I moved the bed away from the wall and moved the monitor closer to the headboard on the boxspring on the side facing the wall. Couldn't move it any closer to the headboard than did because the box spring was at an angle and it wouldn't stick.
    Pictures: Note the side of the bed is normally against the wall. I moved it to place the monitor and take the picture:
    Bed: https://www.flickr.com/photos/151342794@N02/32918961716/in/dateposted-public/
    Monitor placement on box spring facing wall - toward headboard https://www.flickr.com/photos/151342794@N02/

  13. bugged-cdn

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Fri Feb 17 2017 21:35:19
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    It looked to me like it had to be placed on the head end of the bed toward the side facing the wall, rather than on the side facing the wall toward the head end

    Say what?!

  14. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 2:10:48
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    David,
    I took a break and figured out the problem. The picture you marked above is an old picture I posted in a prior thread when I thought the person slept with her head at the foot of the bed. The person sleeps with her head against the headboard and the left side of the bed is head-to-foot against the wall. The headboard faces into the room and has a mattress and box spring as shown in the picture below.
    Bed: https://www.flickr.com/photos/151342794@N02/32149569323/in/dateposted-public/
    So where do I put the passive monitor?
    Thanks and hopefully this is it.

  15. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 5:50:27
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    bed-bugscouk - 11 hours ago  » 
    Hi,
    My head may well explode if you ask me to look at it one more time.
    David

    Not that I saw that one coming.

    How about we move the bed a foot out from the wall and take a picture with the person lying in the bed (fully clothed). While I appreciate dealing with problems in your home can be stressful at times helping people is also stressful, this is one of those times.

    David

  16. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 17:45:28
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    David,
    Sorry to cause you anxiety, even though it was not my intention. I reread a lot of your posts and finally figured out where to put the monitor on the headboard around the corner from the dark side. Haha as to the posting with a model.

  17. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 19:39:12
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    Actually on the box spring at the head of the bed around the corner from the dark side.

  18. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 22:04:00
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    The final is correct, head end just around the dark side.

    You almost cost me a life on the first reply and I really don't have that many to spare (you will need to wait for the autobiography to understand that).

    David

  19. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 22:14:49
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    Why don't you tell me now since your autobiography may not come out for a long time.

    I am going to move it to its new location tomorrow.

  20. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 22:38:09
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    Because out of respect for our host I try to keep on topic or at least off certain topics. I have certainly had an eventful life.

    David

  21. FayeState

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    Posted 6 months ago
    Sat Feb 18 2017 23:46:59
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    Sure you have - know you've spent time in US so waiting for you to open your office here.

  22. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Tue Feb 21 2017 22:38:46
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    David,
    I have the monitor in its new location toward the top of the box spring around the corner from the dark side. Because it is an old lumpy box spring, it is impossible to get the top left and right corners of the monitor flat against the box spring at that location. However, the top area between the corners of the monitor is flat against the box spring. Is this ok? Were there bed bugs present would they go to the flat area to get into the monitor? Or, do I need to do something such as move the monitor further down the box spring even though it is my understanding it may not be as ideal a location?
    Thanks.

  23. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 7:26:49
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    Hi,

    As you can see from this image:

    IMG_2970 by David Cain, on Flickr

    The monitor is not fitted flush with the top of the box base but is still effective. By creating a home that is super optimal it is literally the "des res" of the bed bug world. As illustrated by the work of Stephen Kells in about 2011 faecal traces are self aggregating for bed bugs so in essence the more they use the Passive Monitor the more they want to use the Passive Monitor. In the example below it was literally one of the most desirable harbourages that could be created.

    The monitor that was removed when bagged looked like this:

    Passive Monitor removed from case where tenant had not been checking by David Cain, on Flickr

    When you create a composite of this digitally you can see:

    IMG_2970reinsertedmonitor by David Cain, on Flickr

    This is a good illustration of why we know that the weakest link in our approach is the "human interface". If bed bugs are present, so long as the monitor is installed correctly (in a place that bed bugs can get to it) they will do so.

    If you combine the work of Kells in 2011 and the conclusion of the PhD thesis of Richard Naylor from 2012 you start to see why something we designed in 2009 took advantage of aspects of the biology of bed bugs that was not characterized until years later. This process still goes on and I recently reported an observation which lead to a test being conducted which independently verified something which I later found it will be discussed as a massive breakthrough later this year. I think its one of the reasons why a US bed bug specialist once said "that man knows too much about bed bugs, he knows things we don't even understand yet".

    All that said and done we are all still expecting this one to come back clear after 7 and 14 days but at least you will have the skills and tools in place to resolve the issue in future should it arise. Although equally we hope that having learned the lesson of checking when you travel you appreciate that it is avoidable with a little effort.

    Take care.

    David

  24. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 11:32:49
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    If there are any bed bugs on this bed, which hopefully there are not, they can walk to the center of the monitor to get to it rather than going underneath it where the edges are sticking up and won't adhere to the box spring - right?

  25. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 11:44:30
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    Hi,

    It is best to make sure the perimeter is all in contact with the surface to ensure 360 degrees access.

    If this means that you need to apply extra tape do so but ensure that non of the sticky material extends beyond the detection skirt (the bed bugs told me they prefer not to get stuck on glue which is why they will avoid it).

    I am also not sure if I will open an office in the US soon, I kink of like having an ocean between my main stalker and me although as its coming close to his 3rd year anniversary of stalking me which means I should probably ask "is there a lawyer in the house who could help with a cease and desist".

    David

  26. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 11:48:54
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    Thanks. Do you think that would be better than moving it down the box spring?

  27. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 11:51:49
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    At that level it should make no difference so do the one that gives you faster closure.

    David

  28. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 12:14:49
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    Open an office in the US any way - do it in Chicago, 1000 miles away.

  29. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 12:32:00
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    Maybe this is what is "wrong with Chicago" people are all upset with bed bugs and therefore not getting along because of a lack of sleep!

    Sorry but next office will be somewhere with hot weather in the winter.

    David

  30. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 12:58:02
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    Actually with global warming Chicago has warm weather now in the winter. Like 70 degrees. And Chicagoans will get along better after you solve their bed bug problems without using chemicals.

  31. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 16:09:33
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    David,
    Even using double-sided tape, I can't attach the monitor so that all the perimeter is in contact with the box spring surface to ensure 360 degree access along the "dark edge" front of the box spring where it is suppose to be because it is super lumpy. However, there is no problem attaching it on the dark side of the box spring around the corner from there. Should I put it there, or should I put it between the mattress and box spring, or should I put it on a piece of material like when have an encased box spring? Obviously, I want to put it where it is most optimal. Please advise.
    Thanks.

  32. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 16:13:50
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    Hi,

    Around the corner is the best place. I don't like installing between base and mattress in case the mattress moves too much and seals off access to the monitor.

    Although they will still work this way it tends to limit the access to the monitor to one side which is naturally less inviting.

    David

  33. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 16:24:17
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    Since I don't want to limit access to the monitor to one side by putting it on the dark side, should I attach it to a piece of material like would be done were the box spring encased?
    Thanks.

  34. bed-bugscouk

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Wed Feb 22 2017 16:44:25
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    Hi,

    Only if you cant get it to sit flush without it.

    David

  35. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Sun Mar 5 2017 19:53:30
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    David,
    Took a break for a few days and tried again tonight to put the monitor flush against the box spring, using double-sided tape. I still have little bit of one top corner (the one furthest from the wall) that won't stay flush against the box spring which, as I said before, is very lumpy where the monitor needs to go. Can I put a little regular tape there to hold it down? Can I put a little Kleenex there is fill the tiny gap? Or do I need to do the cloth method of attaching the monitor to a piece of cloth? Can I use a paper towel instead of a piece of cloth? I did a search of the cloth method and have some questions. Do I attach the top of the cloth between the mattress and box spring with tape (does it need to be double-sided tape) and then hang down the cloth on the side of the box spring? Do I use double-sided tape to attach the bottom and sides of the cloth to the box spring?
    Thanks and hopefully I can get this done and it will remain clear.

  36. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Sun Mar 5 2017 23:56:56
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    The monitor does not stick to the box spring, probably because I moved it so many times. The double-sided tape is not strong enough to hold the monitor - it keeps falling. I may just toss this one and use a new one or look for stronger double-sided tape. Not sure what to do. In the meantime, I put it between the mattress and box spring. I want to get it placed so I can start counting the days to see if the bed is clear as I think that will help me a lot psychologically. And, I won't ask you any more about this bed, assuming it's clear, which I'm sure you'd be happy about.

  37. BuggedbyNight

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Mon Mar 6 2017 2:14:51
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    David, you have the patience of a Saint! Lol

  38. bed-bugscouk

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    Mon Mar 6 2017 6:05:50
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    BuggedbyNight - 3 hours ago  » 
    David, you have the patience of a Saint! Lol

    It's OK I balance out my energy by being a sinner at other times. As you can imagine that is literally at an industrial scale.

    David

  39. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Mon Mar 6 2017 6:40:54
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    Hi David,
    Took a break for a few days and tried again last night to put the monitor flush against the box spring. As I mentioned in earlier posts, since the monitor would no longer stick to the lumpy box spring, probably because I had removed it so many times, I tried again many times using double-sided tape which proved not strong enough to hold the monitor and it kept falling. I'm thinking of either using a new monitor or trying to find stronger double-sided tape. What do you recommend? In the mean time I put the monitor between the mattress and box spring, which I know you said is not a first choice, but I feel is better than nothing.
    A couple questions:
    1. If a little bit of a corner of the monitor won't lay flat on the box spring, like happened before the monitor lost its stickiness, can I put a little kleenex to fill in the gap, since I know you said it has to ot be flush against the box spring.
    2. Or do I need to go the cloth method if that happens? If I go the cloth method, can I use a paper towels instead of cloth?
    3. I did a search of the cloth method and have some questions. Do I attach the top of the cloth between the mattress and box spring with tape (does it need to be double-sided tape) and then hang down the cloth on the side of the box spring? Do I use double-sided tape to attach the bottom and sides of the cloth to the box spring?
    I'm obviously anxious for it to be done so I can start counting the 72 hours, 7 days and 14 days. And, I won't ask you any more about this bed, assuming it's clear, which I'm sure you'd be happy about.
    Thanks for all your help.

  40. bed-bugscouk

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    Mon Mar 6 2017 6:41:12
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    Hi,

    Once you have reached 14 days with this one being clear email my office with your address and I will send a new one out. I would appreciate the old one back so that I can recycle it for our internal use and mitigate the losses we will make in doing this.

    In short I would rather we were able to draw a line under this and if that means I need to loose some money to make that happen then at least I can give this as a fine example to those whose perception of what I do is coloured by their own myopia.

    No you cant use a tape around the edges of a Passive Monitor, no you should not "pack the gap". You should ask questions before action and make sure the steps you take are the correct ones.

    Also to be clear, the reason why your Passive Monitor is clear and I am willing to receive it in the post is because you don't have bed bugs.

    David

  41. FayeState

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    Thanks, David, for your response. I will try a new monitor tomorrow. I did not "pack the gap" was just wondering if it was ok to do so, and since you said no, I won't do it. Also, as to tape, I didn't put tape over the top edges of the monitor though I was tempted to do so. I put double-sided tape underneath it.
    As I mentioned in earlier posts, I was not able to get the detection skirt of the old monitor to lay flush against the box spring because the box spring is so lumpy in the location where the monitor should be. About 6 inches below that place on the box spring it is lumpy, but not as much, though I still was not able to get the top corners of the detection skirt totally flush against the box spring. I know you said it is best to make sure the perimeter is all in contact with the surface to ensure 360 degrees access and that if this means that I need to apply extra tape to do so while ensuring that none of the sticky material extends beyond the detection skirt. I will try again to get the detection skirt to lay flush against the box spring without using tape, and, if I still can't do that, I will try to get stronger double-sided tape to put underneath the detection skirt since the tape I have is not strong enough. Is that ok? And, if the stronger double-sided tape doesn't work should I use the cloth method? If so, can I use paper towels instead of cloth, and do I tape the top of the cloth between the box spring and the mattress and then on the box spring so it will lay flat? Do I need to use double-sided tape on the underside of the cloth so it will hold? Or, would you suggest I do something else?
    That is sweet of you to want to reimburse me for the cost of the monitor by supplying a new one. But I can't accept that from you. You have spent a lot of time on this and I don't want you to lose money. I will just count it as an educational expense.

  42. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Thu Mar 16 2017 8:51:04
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    David,
    Can't place the monitor at the location it should be because of the lumpy box spring - have it between mattress and box spring which I know is not ideal. Just thought of a solution - please tell me what you think of it. The foot end of the box spring is not lumpy like the head end is. If I flipped the box spring so what is now the foot end would become the head end is there any problem with that? If there were bed bugs living in the box spring, would they still go to the head of the bed to feed or would they just feed on the sleeper's feet?
    Thanks.

  43. bed-bugscouk

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    Thu Mar 16 2017 9:29:25
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    Hi,

    Swapping the end of the bed around would give you an optimal surface to install on. That should be done by changing the direction of the bed so the occupant can still sleep the same way around.

    To be 100% clear Passive Monitors are installed at the head end of the bed when it is occupied.

    David

  44. FayeState

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    Thanks - flipped the box spring and put on the monitor and it appears to be adhering on all four sides now. Is at the head end of the box spring around the corner from the dark side. Now I'll start counting days.

  45. bed-bugscouk

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    Fri Mar 17 2017 17:58:54
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    Hi,

    I think you have counted enough days already.

    David

  46. FayeState

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    Posted 5 months ago
    Sun Mar 19 2017 10:11:50
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    David,
    Get what you're saying. and, of course, hope you're right.


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