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Any test results for ThermalStrike?
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comp666
newbite
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Posted 11 months ago
Tue May 29 2012 17:50:46
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I'm looking into buying thermal treatment unit and the ThermalStrike seems to be a cheaper option than the Packtite. Have there been any test results by universities or by David Cain for this product? Also, I'm a little confused why it takes 8 hours for this thing to work. I thought the eggs die pretty quickly at 120F.
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oldtimer
Joined: Nov '11
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Posted 11 months ago
Tue May 29 2012 18:02:31
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Dear copm666,
We're looking for 122 F and yes, the BBs die pretty quick at that temperature provided it is applied uniformly and via convection NOT conduction type heat.
Eggs can take somewhat longer to kill than the "crawlers".
It takes a long time (i.e. "8 hours") because we need to assure that the lethal temperatures are delivered throughout the items placed within the heat chamber.
Hope this helps ! paul b.
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oldtimer
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Posted 11 months ago
Tue May 29 2012 18:08:33
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Hi,
I did test and earlier version the data for which was published until the thermalstrike manufacturers asked for it to be taken down or they would take legal action.
I asked to be sent one of the ones for retesting but the last I heard they felt it did not need validating. This may be just another reason why I am so adamant about the need for independant product testing.
As to why it takes so long I have my theories but they are not happy ones.
David Cain
Bed Bugs Limited -
comp666
newbite
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Posted 11 months ago
Tue May 29 2012 18:19:35
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Well that's a little disappointing. I won't buy a product like this unless it's been verified by a third party. My wallet and I really wanted to like the ThermalStrike...
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jean127
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Posted 11 months ago
Tue May 29 2012 19:29:28
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We have a ThermalStrike and have used it several times. We also bought a digital thermometer which we place in the center of the unit. We're aware that the core temperature needs to hit 120 degrees, so we set the thermometer at 120 and when it beeps, we set a timer for 1 hour. Interesting, the temperature continues to increase to about 136 during that time. We don't over pack it (mainly used for luggage, shoes, belts, papers in a sealed contractor plastic bag or Ziplock (my husband travels for business). His clothes go directly into the dryer (unwashed) for 20 minutes on "sterilize" setting...180 degrees for 20 minutes. So far, we've been very pleased with the product. No signs of bed bugs here. Just my two cents worth.
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jean127
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Posted 11 months ago
Tue May 29 2012 19:32:06
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In addition....we never saw the sense in running it for 8 hours provided the core temperature is maintained above 120 for an hour. I'm going to assume that that information may pertain to large quantities within the unit. And "No", we are not affiliated with the company.
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newbite
Joined: May '11
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Posted 11 months ago
Wed May 30 2012 17:57:01
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Hi All,
Testing was conducted by Dr. Changlu Wang of the Rutgers Entomology Department. I received the report from less than two weeks ago and hasn't been posted yet.
Overview of the tests included three Expedition systems pulled from production, two rounds of testing each with a different level of loading (typical and extreme), 100 adult male, 100 nymphs, and 109 eggs. All adults and nymphs were dead immediately after the heat cycle, eggs were monitored for a gestation period and failed to develop.
To answer a question from above, the product was designed to hold a very tight temperature window in order to protect items placed inside. As multiple people have reported, even if left on for a weekend core temperatures do not exceed 140F. The way heat transfer works a system will quickly heat items when the temperature differential is great (like when items are at room temperature), but the change is much slower as it reaches into the target temperatures. We recommend the 8 hour cycle to give several hours of margin for users to treat a typical load. We advise monitoring to people that would like to see shorter cycles or treat atypical loads.
I acknowledge that as David Cain alludes, over a year ago he found a problem with one of our first five units. What isn’t mentioned above is our response to his concerns. We immediately informed our suppliers, pulled the product off Amazon, and redesigned the floor heating system. Units were replaced at the distributors and in the field.
Disclaimer: I am the creator and manufacturer of ThermalStrike Systems
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oldtimer
Joined: Apr '07
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Posted 11 months ago
Wed May 30 2012 18:01:19
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ThermStrk - 1 minute ago »
I acknowledge that as David Cain alludes, over a year ago he found a problem with one of our first five units. What isn’t mentioned above is our response to his concerns. We immediately informed our suppliers, pulled the product off Amazon, and redesigned the floor heating system. Units were replaced at the distributors and in the field.
Did you at any stage attempt to recall those faulty units or are there potentially still consumers using the faulty unit?
I look forward to reading the research report although the validity of the data from that lab has been brought into question a lot in recent years, especially in the area of following testing protocols.
David
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newbite
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Posted 11 months ago
Thu May 31 2012 12:32:25
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As a matter of fact, yes, we did replace units out in the field. Since we had just started out and only had 5 units out there, it was pretty easy to provide customer support through the redesign.
Disclaimer: Creator of ThermalStrike
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oldtimer
Joined: Apr '07
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Posted 11 months ago
Thu May 31 2012 12:50:01
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Are you sure because the consumer that sent me the one I tested never received a recall notice.
David
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newbite
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Posted 11 months ago
Fri Jun 1 2012 12:36:51
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It was also easy to identify which consumer had malicious intent. Once evidence was brought to our attention that your motivations may not as unbiased as you presented, yes, we ceased to work with you or that consumer. Since your consumer did not receive an upgraded base, you’ve confirmed that our assumption was correct.
I've tried to be gracious and openly credit you for your role as a consumer watchdog. Our products are better and meticulously tested knowing that you are gunning for me…but, I'm done answering to your public bullying.
If people have questions about our products, please ask, if you have concerns, please post as we will continue to improve the product.
Mike – Creator of the ThermalStrike System
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oldtimer
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Posted 11 months ago
Fri Jun 1 2012 13:08:55
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Mike,
Surely if you suspected malicious intent the correct thing to do would have been to send out the replacement unit to prove you had got it right. This would have given you a chance to show that you are serious about your product being of value to people.
I will happily test one again should you care to send me a unit but the condition of doing so would also be that you remove your cease and desists order on any results, care to play at those odds?
If you think this is bullying what do you call that pathetic letter I had from your legal team and the gloating emails I was sent from your partners in the northern states? Sadly the second cease and desist I received connected with them was even more badly written than your and as such was not valid in the UK so we just ignored it. I am happy to ask my legal team to look at the wording of your one again if you want to accuse me of bullying.
Its simple if you want to build consumer confidence I challenge you to send a unit for testing in a lab that is not in the pocket of your cronies.
David
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btaggart
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Joined: Apr '09
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Posted 11 months ago
Fri Jun 1 2012 13:15:19
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I have used this system many times, as well as recommended it to my clients and never had a complaint.
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oldtimer
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Posted 11 months ago
Fri Jun 1 2012 14:00:28
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btaggart - 41 minutes ago »
I have used this system many times, as well as recommended it to my clients and never had a complaint.Hi Brian,
Have you actually run micro data sensors on the bottom and bottom of the side walls because that is where I found some of the original cool spots and where I pulled a vial of live bedbugs out of it after 10 hours.
OK you may have the new ones and I have the only old one left in existence but that may be a sign that Mr Lindsey like you and your mates me than me. I just don't understand why when I am such a loving and giving person.
David
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theyareoutthere
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Posted 11 months ago
Fri Jun 1 2012 20:34:33
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I don't think I would have been one of the first five customers, but I did receive an upgraded base when I called about having problems with the connector. Since I have NO training or understanding, I'm not going to comment on 8 hours..other to say, I always ran it 8 hours.
So, technically, it sounds like an entomologist tested it and they would have put some in the potential cool spots. I like the idea of field testing, too, in a home with BBs..monitored by a scientist. There have been comments that the little buggers will find cool spots we can't even think of and there are human nature errors that could be identified.
Glad to hear there is some tests behind it. I found the customer service to be excellent but ended up getting a Closet to hang items in...but it's a lot more expensive...and I really don't understand science.
Please be play nice, David and Mike.
TAOT
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comp666
newbite
Joined: May '12
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Posted 11 months ago
Sat Jun 2 2012 3:09:34
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Well, gen 1 is in the past and I could care less about its flaws. It's not unreasonable for a brand new product to have problems. What I do care about is gen2. Please post the Rutgers study or send a sample to David. I really don't want to shell out 300 bucks for a packtite if the thermalstrike will suffice
Also, ThermStrk, maybe I'm missing something, but how is surfacing a problem in your product "malicious intent"? They potentially saved you millions in lawsuits and saved the consumers a bunch of headaches.
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